KWS SAAT SE & Co KgaA
XETRA:KWS
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KWS SAAT SE & Co KgaA
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Hello, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the KWS 9 months 2022/'23 Results Call. [Operator Instructions] Let me now turn the floor over to your host, facile. Thank you very much, and good morning, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Eva Kienle.
Thank you very much, and good morning, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Eva Kienle. I am the CFO of KWS Group, and I'm happy to present you very positive results for our first 9 months. So welcome to the occasion of this conference call, and let's look into the details.I'm very pleased to report to you today about a very successful business performance in the first 9 months of the current financial year '22/'23. Not only do we benefit from a very positive conditions in the agricultural market, but also from the continued strong performance of our innovative product portfolio.We increased sales by around 25% and achieved a significant growth in all crop segments. To a certain extent, seasonal shifting effects, meaning slightly earlier deliveries done in the same period of previous year, also contributed to this. Nevertheless, we expect a significant double-digit growth in the range of 15% for the fiscal year as a whole, which is at the upper end of our previous forecast range.Our growth this year is mainly attributable to higher selling prices, which enable us to more than compensate for inflationary cost increases. This is also reflected in our EBIT performance, where we recorded an outstanding increase of around 30%. On this basis and with good visibility for the remaining weeks of the fiscal year, we have once again raised our forecast, both in terms of sales as well as EBIT margin. All in all, this is a very pleasing picture so that we can also subscribe to another record year for KWS.Looking at the current market development, it can be said that agricultural commodity prices have moved away from their highs, but are still well above the historical average of recent years, creating a positive business environment for both farmers and seed companies. We are currently in the process of finalizing our business plans for the upcoming financial years, which we look at in great [ continents ]. Although the particular high growth rates over the last 2 years will likely not be achieved so easily.After these introductory remarks, let's now take a look at our key financial figures in the first 9 months. In the increased sales of 25%, exchange rate effect had only a slight impact on sales all in all. Positive foreign exchange effects, especially from the Brazilian reais and from countries in Eastern Europe were largely offset by the negative impact of highly inflationary countries, Argentina and Turkey.EBITDA and EBIT increased over proportionally by 32% and 40%, respectively. In our financial results, we have recorded a significant decline to almost EUR 90 million. Both higher interest expenses and the decline in earnings from our equity accounted joint ventures had a negative impact here.For the year as a whole, we expect these effects to continue. The bottom line is a significant increase in net income or earnings per share of around 32%. In terms of operating cash flow, we continue to be in negative territory due to the seasonality of our business, but at the level of the previous year, which I believe is a good success in view of our significant expansion of business.In terms of capital expenditures, we are developing in line with our expectations of around EUR 100 million capital expenditure for the total year. Net debt increased again on the reporting date due to seasonal factors. A reduction is expected at the end of the financial year, especially with regard to short-term financing.Now let's move on to the individual product segments. Sales in the corn segment increased by 25%, and we are thus well on track to break the EUR 1 billion level in sales this fiscal year. Growth in the corn segment was once again driven by Brazil and Europe, where we achieved a very strong performance with our high-performance corn hybrids.Our North American joint venture, AgReliant, on the other hand, recorded again disappointing sales with declining volumes. In the course of the positive sales development, the segment's result also rose significantly from EUR 73 million to EUR 93 million, driven by our European business and an increase in earnings in Brazil.For the corn segment, we continue to expect a significant increase in sales in the current fiscal year, but now expect an EBIT margin slightly below the previous year's level due to lower earning contributions from AgReliant.Now let's move on to the sugarbeet segment. With also a 25% increase in sales and overall stable acreage for sugarbeet, we are once again underpinning our position as a global market leader in this area. This development is closely linked to the success of our innovations such as CONVISO SMART and Cercospora Plus, [ CR+ ], which now accounts for 40% of our total sales.In the fourth quarter, we expect further sales for the segment, especially North America, so that nothing should stand in a way of another record year for sugarbeet. The positive business development is also reflected in earnings where the EBIT rose from EUR 162 million to EUR 195 million. This already includes a write-off from the destruction of stocks as a result of changes in the regulatory framework for crop protection products in Europe in a mid-single-digit million range.Against the backdrop of a strong business performance, we continue to expect significant sales growth for the year as a whole and now even expect a slight improvement in margins compared to the previous year.Now let's move on to the cereal segment, which already generates the majority of the business in the first half of fiscal year. Here, we achieved a strong increase of 20% compared to the previous year. The main driver of growth was once again our rapeseed business with an increase of 33% followed by wheat and rye.In addition to the mentioned crops, sorghum, a less well-known but very robust and healthy cereal also recorded an increase, especially in Brazil. The segment's very positive business performance is also reflected in our earnings figures. With an EBIT of EUR 72 million, we achieved significant year-on-year growth driven by price effects and product mix. We are also raising our forecast for the cereal segment slightly for the year as a whole and expect a slight increase in profitability.Coming now to our vegetable segment, which has now returned to growth after challenging 2 years, mainly due to COVID. As expected, we are seeing a normalization of demand here and are recording a growth path, especially in sales of spinach seeds to the U.S. and China. This also contributes to the significant improvement in the segment's underlying profitability.Excluding the effect of the purchase price allocation from the Pop Vriend acquisition and planned R&D expenditure for the breeding of new vegetable varieties, the EBIT was around plus EUR 10 million, which corresponds to a very strong underlying good profitability of the business of over 20% in terms of EBIT margin.In line with our long-term plans, we are continuing to invest in the expansion of our breeding activities. We have now established breeding teams and stations in Italy, Spain, Turkey, Mexico and Brazil, to drive our breeding programs forward. So here, we are right on schedule, and this will be reflected in growing business in the medium term. We are now also more optimistic about our full year forecast in the vegetable segment, especially with regard to profitability.Finally, let's take a look at our expectations for the KWS Group in the current financial year. As already mentioned, we have already raised our forecast last week with an ad hoc announcement. In terms of sales, we now see ourselves at the upper end of previous forecast of 13% to 15%. We are now aiming for an EBIT margin of 11% to 12%, that is 1 margin point higher than originally expected. And we now expect the R&D ratio to around 18% to 19%, continuing to invest in future innovations as planned and at a high level. All in all, we are well on our way to a successful financial year, the results of which we will report to you at the end of September.With this, I would like to conclude my presentation. I thank you for your attention. I'm looking forward to your questions.
[Operator Instructions] And the first question comes from Christian Faitz from Kepler Cheuvreux.
Yes. I have a couple of questions, if I may, and then I'll get back in line. First of all, can you elucidate what kind of inventory measures in sugarbeet seeds you had to take due to change -- regulatory issues? And then the other point is, which other areas in vegetables are you currently targeting? You mentioned you're beefing up R&D investments in various regions. And in this context, how much does spinach make up in your current vegetable seeds portfolio?
First question, a little more background on the inventory measures. You might all be aware that the European Union is more and more restricting the use of herbicides and insecticides for agriculture. And some years back, the famous neonics, to make it short, normal word is very complicated -- has been banned for application fields. And also the sugar beet pills are coated with a neonic treatment. So this has been banned some years back already, but there have been derogations for a lot of countries in the European countries -- in the European Union still to be used. So we had prepared -- under the derogation scheme we had prepared the product to be sold for sowing season '23, that is March, April. And then in February, there was a court case of the European Court of Justice that confirmed the ban again very strictly and that canceled all the derogations that had been granted, especially in France. So the derogation was not granted any longer in France, and we had already produced the product for France to be sold and -- of course, sold and exported. So we had to destroy all the inventories that was on our stocks for France, and that was a single-digit million euro amount that we had to take to the results because we could not sell and we had to destroy this product.On the second -- sorry? On the second question, vegetable areas. I mentioned the main regions where we are building up our stations. And this is also the areas where we will basically do business, so Italy, Spain, Mexico, South America, Turkey, the Mediterranean area. Focus crops are tomato, pepper, cucumbers, melon and watermelon. And then, of course, with the acquisition of Pop Vriend and a smaller tomato breeder in Italy, Geneplanta, we have already some commercial products that we are selling. And out of those sales, so there's a lot more others like a little bit of onion, [indiscernible] chard, Swiss Chard, red beet. Spinach is about 80% of the total sales of the vegetable so far.
The next question comes from Andreas Heine from Stifel.
I'd like to start with corn. So we were extremely successful in Europe and Latin America and gained share. But it is the opposite with AgReliant in the U.S., where sales were declining while Bayer today reported plus 16%. With the strong growth you have in Brazil and Europe, I would assume that in those regions, you have seen quite a strong margin increase, which was all -- margin-wise, offset by AgReliant, which seems in the margin to become very low and is losing ground. Is there anything you can do to change this? Or is that only be possible over the very long term, so it's -- is there something in new varieties coming changing this? That's my first question, and I'll come later back to the others.
So very clear analysis and you depicted it right. The issue with the American corn business is that in the last years, we have concluded -- or you might remember that we have concluded a trade access agreement with Syngenta some years back in order to increase the margin. So with an upfront payment, the plan is to sort of replace the running costs of trade usage in corn and having thus an increased margin. However, the proportion of the portfolio that we are -- and we are still today using a lot of Bayer traded products -- is very high. So the art of switching the portfolio to increase margins moving away from Bayer more to the Syngenta portfolio is very, very sort of difficult to steer. And of course, that comes along with price -- policies and price increases that we want to make. So of course, if we talk about Monsanto related products, there is a strong link made to the Bayer product, and there is a huge competition in the marketplace, of course, especially by Bayer.You have rightly quoted, so -- that they have one in most cases, the competition in the marketplace. So the mid to long-term strategy to increase margin is clearly depending on increasing the share of proprietary germplasm in the U.S. market and sort of reducing further slow by [ slow ], the Bayer -- or Monsanto or Bayer traded product and germplasm. However, again, in the marketplace for commercial going to market, this is limiting quite a bit the price freedom we have because here, of course, we always have to pay a price for the in-licensed trades here in -- from Bayer and -- in that case. So that's why the change is really more mid than long term.And on the other hand, we are clearly not satisfied with losing volumes. And also a main reason for losing volumes that we had quite some churn in our sales force. And we lost some customers with that, and this has been analyzed clearly, and we know the regions and the reasons for this. And this is the gap that we run into because we had a sort of a churn in some of the district sales managers that was not expected and that the customers were lost. So that is the main reason for the real underpromising performance in this fiscal year.
Well, the change in the sales force, that might be a more short-term issue. Can I confirm that that you are still satisfied with the performance of your new varieties into germplasm?
Absolutely.
Which is most important, actually.
Absolutely.
So the losing ground is not due to being less competitive to Corteva and Bayer in the performance...
No, product performance is okay.
Then the next question is on sugarbeet. I guess I ask this question every year. It's just an outstanding performance again. Congrats on that. It is driven very much by the trades you have, which are unique and different selling point for you, both now Cercospora and CONVISO SMART, and you were able to increase the margin slightly. And I know that you always have to find the right compromise and investing in the future with R&D and showing higher results. Going forward, I would assume that the penetration -- maybe not in the same speed, but the penetration of CONVISO SMART and Cercospora will further increase, which means that the price per unit or per acre is going up. And you know this, of course. So then you plan your R&D accordingly. With the market share increasing north to 60% you have anyhow -- well, I would say, from the total R&D budget all of your peers can spend, you have not only more than 60% as your market shares, but probably more than 80%. So I would say there is a limit to need to invest more in R&D and to show more in earnings and margins. Maybe you can share your thoughts on these assumptions?
So where to start with a word -- how to slice it. Maybe starting with the shift of -- gives you an idea on technically what it means. If we look back like 5 years back into '18-'19, looking at sort of the mix of product that sugarbeet was offering, we were 2/3 of what we call classic varieties and maybe 1/3 of Roundup Ready and a very, very tiny bit of CONVISO when we started in '18-'19. Now for this year, we expect the innovations, so Cercospora, CONVISO and Roundup Ready in comparison to the classical varieties, to be already -- to make up already over 50% if you take the whole -- sort of the whole sugarbeet assortment, and this is going to grow always close to 70% in the next 2 years. So there will be a very clear movement into innovation, into the -- sort of the higher quality -- or higher quality product at the cost of classic varieties.And that clearly means that, of course, prices that -- if sales are going up. Margins, however, are not necessarily going up. And this is -- to some effect, also has had some technical reasons. Of course, the absolute terms, the margin is increasing. But for example, you know that for CONVISO, we had this part of tax fee that is then also shared with a [ Bayer ] on the herbicide that comes along with the sugarbeet. So there is a sort of -- there's a slight erosion percentage-wise in the margin. In absolute terms, it's definitely going to increase.And don't forget, while we are now cashing in on the innovations that have been creating R&D costs 10, 20 years back, we are now already working on the next generation to come. So there is no right -- sort of direct connect between today's R&D costs and the sales and margin development. We are now spending heavily, investing R&D into the next herbicide tolerance.So the after Roundup Ready era, genetically modified, trade – [ it's ] herbicide resistant, and that costs millions, especially deregulation for the U.S. market. So while we are now seeing the profit on CONVISO and Cercospora, which is, as you know, non-GM varieties, we are already now spending money for the herbicide second-generation GMO tolerance. So that's why you won't see a decrease in the R&D spending in the next years in sugarbeet.
Well, is that -- I'll never ever expect a decline in R&D spending, but is the R&D spending going up in line with what you can -- what you envisage in sales, so to speak, that the R&D percentage to sales stays the same in the sugarbeet? Or is there a flattening?
Well, that's a changing pattern, is -- what we do is, of course, we target the overall R&D budget, which is -- which as we said, 18% to 90% of sales. And then there might be a shift from one year to the other or in a 2 or 3 years' term between the crops. So there is not a pot bucket per crop that is sort of managed or related stable. We look at the programs, we look at the results year-on-year. And if we might have a very, very positive and very speedy year in sugarbeet, we might the year after allocate some means from sugarbeet to corn or oilseed rape or vegetables and the other way round. So if we see, we are not sort of -- we need another 2 or 3 years to get really to turn the vegetables. We might not sort of push more money into that because we need to time on the results to choose and select and then we put it in other well places. So we are not steering percentage-wise by crop on what we spend in R&D.
And then the last question is, cereals had an outstanding performance. Hybrid rye we know and rapeseed we know. Could you spend a minute on the smaller crops which you mentioned, also contributing to growth and what their perspectives are?
Yes. So there's quite a lot in this segment. By far, the largest now roughly EUR 90 million of turnover in the first 9 months is right. Then the second largest crop is oilseed rape that is here. As I mentioned, that was a very, very nice performance in the first 9 months, so over 30% growth compared to the last year. Then the next biggest crop in [ here ] is wheat, which also grew by almost 20%. That's what I mentioned. Then we come -- get over to Barley. Barley is a little stable, so there is very little development in barley. And the other thing I mentioned is sorghum. That's a very small proportion, but that's the fifth largest. It's grown by over 100% as doubled sales in sorghum. And there comes a lot of smaller crops that have either, but very, very small numbers significantly [ to grown ] like catch crops or also, for example, peas and lentils. So we talked to you about small EUR 1 million, EUR 1.5 million, EUR 1.1 million. So that's [ really ] small numbers compared to the other big crops. So -- but very, very nice growth.The rye growth is still the smallest. So clearly doubling in sorghum, 30% in rapeseed, 20% in wheat and a stable barley. That's the main contributor to the first 9 month.
So that basically means that the very well-known largest are also which will drive the growth in the coming years? The others…
That is a good question. I would say the distance to the others by sales is still quite high, but we see -- as I say, we see a strong uptake in sorghum. We see a strong uptake in organic seeds, in peas. So that's depending on our strategic path because we are now putting more emphasis on protein plants and starting more programs for plant-based proteins. So that's why there might be an overproportion of relative increase in the smaller ones. But again, relating EUR 1 million to EUR 90 million, you see that there is a huge difference there.
[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from Michael Schaefer from ODDO BHF.
3 of them. First one is on sugar beet, coming back to the success story and penetration story of CONVISO and CR/CR+, so I wonder -- you indicated that the share is increasing on a combined basis to 70% the next couple of years. I know part of the story at CONVISO SMART always has been the application in Russia with those kind of acreages and the design and the structure of the market. So I wonder -- is this a threat what we hear from Russia basically that they are planning to ban, let's say, seed imports and which may affect, let's say, your growth path there in sugar? But what are you making out of that in terms of, let's say, short-term, midterm outlook there?
Yes. So Russia is a daily sort of watch out and daily management of the situation. The law that you were mentioning or what you're referring to is in the pipeline. It is supposed to be decided upon by September, October this year. And it proposes to regulate the import of foreign seeds to certain quota, and of course, that includes all crops -- not only sugar beet, but all crops, and there are different quotas still to be allowed for imports per crop. The point being for sugar beet, there is a reality that sugar beet feed cannot be multiplied in Russia. By climate conditions, it's not possible to grow and to produce or multiply sugar beet seeds in Russia. One should know that. Sometimes politic go beyond -- or politic considerations go beyond biology. So the government is clearly of the conviction that it will be possible to localize sugar beet also into Russia, which we definitely don't see, sugar industry neither.So there's strong lobbying efforts and strong discussions also from the Russian sugar producers with the government. So what we are expecting is that there might be a very, very small quota that could be imposed on sugar beet and that is very, very, very slowly increasing. So to give you an idea, our first indications might say that they might sort of put a local quota, locally to be produced of around 20% in 10 years' time. So that's the expectation as of today.Again, we know there is a strong opposition between logic and politics. And if it comes that they are really putting import quota, then of course, that fact, sugar has still higher priority in Russia. And also to be known is quota cannot be imposed on what there is sort of a Pan Russian trading union that is existing, which includes, for example, Kazakhstan and Belarus. So the Russian quota would not hold up against import -- any imports for Kazakhstan or Belarus because they cannot ban their trading partners from those imports. So we're also thinking about ways of sending sugar beet seeds and other seeds through one of those neighboring countries, most -- of course, most likely Kazakhstan.
The second one is coming back to AgReliant. I mean we touched this point for quite some time now, and the deed I understood -- basically the transition and then that it takes a long time basically to increase the share of germplasm and Syngenta trades, et cetera. Now we have seen recently a change in the owners, or at least the perceived range in the ownership structure of your JV partner. So is this anything which may make you think basically more strategically to streamline operations there and to get it under full control? Is this something which you may look at as a result of what we have heard from [ Wilmar ]?
So you're referring to the announcement of [ Wilmar ] they're sort of buying back or they want to sort of delist the shares from the market. The discussion or the information we shared -- or the discussion we had with them is that they feel a larger freedom to operate strategically if they have, again, not the sort of strict regulations and constraints from a capital market. This is somehow a reasoning for us. It's hard to share because that means that any growth would either need to be financed from the shareholders, which is, as we know, all its pharma cooperatives. So there is not abundant means available in this cooperative, individual farmers, and there's hundreds of farmers that own the shares.And that means the other perspective is that they would have to finance externally through banks, which is -- comes at a cost and increasing cost as we know. So we have not yet fully depicted on -- but it's all considerations. We don't know on -- their thoughts on that.With regards to our joint venture, there is nothing to change. So clearly, we have aligned them on that. We have seen very, very close meetings in the recent weeks because of the budget and the AgReliant expectations. And there is nothing that is indicated or shared or discussed with us about, we want to also cash in on that and do we want to take it over, whatever. So nothing at all from that perspective.
Last question is on vegetables. Well, thanks for sharing basically the R&D budget in the first 9 months, so the EUR 11 million. So I wonder whether you can indicate maybe on a full year basis -- and then I know that obviously, there are a lot of breeding programs going on and you want to accelerate that. So what we should think about the R&D allocated to vegetables, which is a bit of a special animal in your portfolio there. So what should we think about next 2, 3 years in terms of R&D budget acceleration?
Yes. So the current plan -- and again, we're discussing about the current plan. The current plan go to a maximum sort of in the next years to EUR 15 million to EUR 20 million. Again, it depends on the success of the current breeding programs. And it might be that, again, for example, like in Geneplanta, if we have a chance or the possibility to acquire another smaller stand-alone breeder, of course, then we have increasing R&Ds that come along with that breeding operation, which usually the smaller ones have nice germplasm breeding programs and very sort of limited sales. So that, of course, can be sort of [ spoon ] fixed, you would say, in German additions to the R&D budget in the coming years, which we don't have very, very concrete as of today.
The next question comes from Christian Faitz again.
Yes. Just one follow-up question remaining. On hybrid wheat, how is your breeding program on that front at the moment? Are you getting anywhere?
Yes, we are getting anywhere. So the milestones are very successful and have been successfully completed to complete or to reach a hybrid crop. Again, however, it takes some more 10 years to really make it sort of repetitive and reproducible and at an adequate quality. It comes right now with still a significant yield [ drain ]. So we are now improving the yields under the hybrid crop, and that is, of course, what you're aiming for. So if you can make a plant hybrid, but still the yield is not attractive enough, then you cannot commercialize with the price levels that you're expecting. So this is why it needs some more time to confirm the heterosis effect here.
So the heterosis effect is only promising you're saying?
Yes.
And we have a question from Andreas Heine.
Yes. I would like to come back to Brazil and the earnings there. So I see strong growth, and meanwhile, also a progression in EBIT margin. But on the other hand, you had high interest costs in financing the net working capital. Could you outline how that is going forward? Because net working capital with your growth will hopefully increase further. But if that then jeopardizes your profitability, that is, of course, not great. Is anything you can do to finally get also the earnings to a level which represents the nice market share of 10% you might have now in that region?
We have started last year already different considerations and programs to free up cash, so to sort of manage net working capital in a more, let's say, aggressive would be the wrong word, but put more focus clearly on the net working capital management and on the planning and the production planning and also with regard to means and models on how we can [ insight ] customers to pay earlier or even to go to pre-cash sales. So there are about a dozen of programs, different programs in Brazil that we are undertaking with the business to really get an earlier cash result. We had started some years back, but it comes at also very high cost. We had started a program from sort of factoring, but it's a little more complicated. It's special to Brazil, it's called FIDC. So we had started a program where there is a fund where you can allocate certain accounts receivables to and you get the money. But again, it comes also at a cost.So that's not much more cost efficient than financing or it's interest cost to loans. That's why we're switching again. And of course, we have to balance the growth also a little bit more looking forward and steer that one a little better. There's little we can do on the accounts payable side.So the target, the focus is on inventory management. We have also now carefully managed the inventory. We have looked at, as I mentioned, the safety stock, so to say, and the steering -- or the proper out steering of portfolio and of outdated products. And that should help really look inventory levels a little down in the next years compared to growth and also to get some more cash in due to customer models that we are implementing.
If it comes to the interest cost, is there any way that you finance this, let's say, from Europe? Really does it have to be financed at very high interest rates in Brazil?
Well, both. But even if we finance from Europe, we would have to charge in the company interest at arms length. Of course, it's a little more favorable, but we cannot charge – or the other thing is that we give equity in. That depends on -- and we have done a mixture of equity increases in the company loans and local loans, also favorable, let's say, research-based loans that you can tap into from the Brazilian state.So from an interest level perspective, we're really trying our best to make it a mixture of the best sort of cost possible, but there comes also to limit clearly when the over-debtedness of indebtedness in Brazil is so high that the banks say they need either a parent guarantee or again, the equity needs to be increased. That's why we have to look into cash improvement.
Lastly, then also on Brazil, if it comes to the performance on EBIT. I don't know how you didn't want to go there. But in recent years, you had to invest a lot in growing the infrastructure and the production facilities now approaching these 10%. I get most of that is done. Can we expect that the EBIT margin will reflect that most of these start-up investments or growing investments are done and that the margin goes to -- maybe not where Europe is, but to a very decent level?So usually, it's as much percentage you have as much the EBIT margin should be. So 10% EBIT margin would then be the right to look at? Any thoughts on that?
Yes. There is still one more production expansion to become. The question is the years exactly, we don't know. But the growth pace of the last year's and also chances that we still see is requiring some more investment in -- especially in the corn storage and in the shelling and drying capacities there. Again, you -- also especially due to 2 seasons. And then, of course, we're trying to increase the margin, especially through the product portfolio mix, and also here a higher share of own germplasm, which we are very well underway. We have, again, very promising hybrids in the pipeline, and you might have seen that in the last years, we have even sort of won a price in the marketplace for having the most -- that they liked corn variety in Brazil. So they have sort of hit list every year that the farmers [ hoard on ], which is the most -- sort of mostly loved corn variety. So that -- year-by-year, the profitability should improve but not in big steps and certainly not up to over, as you mentioned, over 10%. That's basically due to the GM related part of the business.
You changed that also, right, to the Syngenta trades that you have?
Yes.
Which is already. So then why should the margin not get to the 10%, if half your...
10% is feasible, but not very much beyond.
Okay. So at the moment, there seem to be no further questions. [Operator Instructions]
Okay. So, as there seem to be no more questions, I thank you very much all for your participation, for your interest in KWS. I'm happy that we could prove you that the business model is maybe not sexy in the sense of super stable, super steep growth and very increasing profitability, but it's really more of the marathon invest. We are expecting another great year. We are well underway, irrespective of inflation, more global practices because people need to eat, and the production -- food production needs to go on. So happy to have you on board and hope to talk to you soon, especially for the publication of our full year results '22/'23. Looking to that occasion to meet you all again in September. And thank you very much. Have a nice day. Bye-bye.