Troax Group AB (publ)

STO:TROAX

Earnings Call Transcript 2021-Q2

[Operator]

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the presentation Q2 report 2021. [Operator Instructions] Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. [Operator Instructions] I would now like to turn the conference over to your speaker today, Mr. Thomas Widstrand. Thank you. Please go ahead, sir.

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Thank you very much, and very welcome to this presentation of Troax Group second quarter financial results or presentation. And I think most of you are used to this kind of presentation. So nevertheless, I will inform you then that you can find this -- template that I will work from, you can find it on the ir.traox.com home page or web page and you will find it on the investors and then you find in the presentation for Q2. But if you don't have it, you will be able to follow, I think, what I'm saying, in any case because I don't follow along my usual presentation, which means we'll go through a number of figures, and I'll try to comment some things which have influenced in positive or negative our development, especially in the second quarter. So to start on with Troax, I guess that most of you, as I said, are well acquainted with Troax. But as you know, we try to stay safe, and that's what I'm starting with, and we try to get our customers all safe. And that's really our business idea. And just quickly to go through a little bit of the background. We are working in 3 different, what we call segments. And the biggest one is called Machine Guarding. And as you see from the picture, it shows then obviously, what we are doing, protecting people and from changes, obviously in this case, robots, we are working along a manufacturing line for cars. This is approximately 65% of our turnover. And if you take the next page, it's called warehouse partitioning. It's approximately 21% of our turnover. And as you can see from the picture, we're talking about devices or guarding and protecting them, for instance,what you have on the shelves from falling down on people who are perhaps working in your warehouse or people are working in their focus trucks. So I think that's always self-explanatory. And the third and the smallest segment that we work on in is nevertheless very important. It's what we call storage solutions or property protection. It's primarily, I would say, in all the Europe segment. It's approximately 14% of our turnover. And as you can see, it's not so much about protecting the people, it's more about protecting, of course, what you tend to have in your storage area like skis or bicycles or whatever you got, to protect that from everybody at least within a reasonable amount of effort. And then if you go to the next page, we actually have something which is a mix between Machine Guarding and the warehouse part, and we call it Automated Warehouse, where surprisingly enough, you can see then that we are focused on -- as the working price. Automated warehouses which is growing substantially at this moment and has been doing so for several years now, actually, and that's all for something which we are profiting from. And as you see from the picture, it's basically the all in the warehouse, but it's, of course, automated to a major extent. And you have no lines around, for then -- picked over the goods that are on these sides or these shelves are fixed, of course, and by some sort of robots or some sort of machine which is collecting and the items and protected place and where someone probably [indiscernible] automatically put it on the car and then bring it on to distributor or retail market or whatever. And this is something that is growing very much. And I will come back to that a little bit later. And the next page shows the list from 2020, I think I'll just keep that. For you, those of you who are interested, you've seen the development of 2020, which a bit was a difficult year for obvious reasons we recall. Within, you see also the pickup of the sales in the region. But I think you can reassure yourself if you feel interested in. And we also have next page where you see also the UMDs where we say -- one of the other global leader of the perimeter's protection, were approximately 2.5x larger than Number 2 player. We are a growth company even if for 2020, it was difficult to grow. We are poking at 2.5x of bigger presence in 42 countries. And historically, we had a growth of, let's say, 8%, 9% organically and including some few acquisitions have been made when the growth per year has been 11, 12 years. Going to the next page, I'll talk a little bit about financial targets. And we don't -- as regards to the first one, which is called sales growth, we don't really say exactly what our project is. But we definitely aim to grow more than the market is growing, an overall business cycle. Our estimate is that the market is growing with some 46% per year. And that means, of course, we should grow more, which we have done -- as I said before, historically done. So then coming back to what we did now for the first half year, and I would say that we've been growing substantially. So we've been actually having a, I would say, a very good second quarter, and I will come back to that. So organically, we've been growing 40% and we go to have the acquisition that we did first of November in Poland called Natom Logistics and that event is [indiscernible]. So total -- so we've been growing with some 60% compared to last year, which revenue left was negatively influenced by the COVID. So you have to take that high percentage rates years, of course, positive influenced by these. Not an easy comparison. When you go to profitability, we should be on 20% on EBITDA margin and due, of course, mainly to good volume and good cost control and good utilization in factories. We are now actually exceeding this for the first half year. So we're up to 21.6%, which is so far, how do we say, a good figure. We've already a capital structure with the third target that we have. We are saying that the net debt in relation to EBITDA should not exceed 2.5x and we are a year beyond that. So we are 1.2. I think we paid a dividend in May, June. So it's a good figure, I would say, showing that we both have good profitabilities for further acquisitions should such occasion arise and, of course, also to do further investments really to see if we should like to do so. Dividend is starting earlier on. Normally, we have the target to pay out 50%. And that we've paid out this for this year. I will also come back to that next year when we can. The only one doing that. Right. Then we come to some summary of Q2. And I will do that in a some sort of summarized way, but you can say then that the Q2 of 2021 continued with a very strong sale order trend. We started basically in Q1. Towards the end of Q1, we could see some signs of it already towards the end of Q4 last year where we will return then from the difficult COVID period, which somewhat, I wouldn't say normal situation, but at least it's a better situation than it was previously during 2020. And I think there is a certain effect then of, what I call, a catch-up effect in the very good figures of Q2. We cannot really estimate how big t is. Of course, the market has been very good. And as I said, there is a certain element of this catch-up effect. But basically, I would say that Q2, this is characterized by good demand from customers more or less in all parts of the world, in all parts of our different segments. And then on top of that, we probably had some sort of effect of this catch-up effect coming from projects which has been delayed because of COVID. Nevertheless, we have seen and if I'm right in this summary. The demand has been, I would say, especially strong then, of course, with Automated Warehouse, which is continuing the very positive trend from before. But also Machine Guarding has been improving during second quarter. And I think I wrote somewhere on that, the automotive has started to be more active. And -- not saying that it's fantastic because it's far from that, but we clearly see then that the automotive activity was much stronger in the second quarter compared with the previous half year. That's a good sign. So because of them, we had very good order intake in the second quarter. We had quite good also in the first quarter, at least a decent one. That, of course, was turning to major extending to sales during the second quarter. So that means, of course on that, if we get a good sales levels, we invoice a lot, we manufacture a lot. This was, of course, creating the good results. So if you look at the results, which we will do in a second, basically then for the quarter, the operating profit has more than doubled for the quarter. And if you look at the first 6 months, it's basically has very good results, which is a very strong development. We aren't used to having those kind of growth figures actually. So earnings per share then are actually then more than doubled. So going from EUR 0.08 last year to EUR 0.19. This quarter. Just a few words on the working capital. It's on the expected level. Inventory is still high due to that, we've done some precautions as we say in connection with the corona effect. And we intend to keep it like that until we see that things are really stabilizing. And we think that the end of the year we will still be able -- some turbulence with deliveries of steel and especially, of course, on oil prices. So I think we intend to keep it on this level. Otherwise, we have a stable capital, I think, nothing which otherwise is really worth mentioning. So because of the good sales level, which I touched upon before. I also said and briefly, that all the manufacturing units have had a very good development in Q2 with very good volumes. And despite the fact that the steel prices continue to be affected with turbulence, meaning going up substantially. We have been able to, I would say, basically to compensate that. There are some delays in the price increase because the fee cut has been not so considerably in a very short time. But nevertheless, I would say that we have, on the whole, been able to have this thing in a good way, in cooperation with our customers because obviously, we don't want them to suffer more than what is really necessary. So I think we had a good dialogue with most of our customers. But nevertheless, there has been increase in the price. Going to our acquisition, Natom in Poland, outside of Poznan that has continued to have a very good -- in the last months also in the second quarter. And especially then with good inflow or orders coming from the warehouse segment, this is where they are. So there's nothing strange with that. But if anything, that has been even stronger, I would say, in quarter 2 than quarter 1. So far, we are quite pleased with that development and obviously, this has also been terminal to good sales and also a reasonable result. So we are, as I said, quite pleased with it so far. We are working with a new facility where we intend then to merge the 2 factories in which we are exiting today, into one. And the first factory, or which is part of the first factory will be starting to be transferred now in the fourth quarter. Moving into a bit, I think, into 2022. And then we take the next one a little bit later in 2022, depending on when we can get the proper electricity into the design. We have also then, as we have informed separately, purchased on the guarding activities referring to aluminum from ABB, the product frames to protect art. And we purchased that on first of July, and there's been some trends now of machines during the summer period. So we do intend now to start the frame manufacturing and deliveries on first September. We already got some orders from ABB customers. And we will see how quickly we can take this up, but I think we will be prepared to start working with this in an operational level from September 1. Going to the next page, we talk about the financial highlights and some we already touched upon and that the results were substantially improved. And if we go through the 3 month period, you see it as a substantial increase in order intake. I will within a second, share with you on where this comes from. And more or less the same results for the sales. Gross profit has been almost double even the margin slightly decreased. Already talked about the operating profit and the margin. So the operating margin was as I said, cumulative for the 6 months, if you look at -- to the middle of the page there, it will give you 21.6% where it was 22.8% for the last quarter. So it's a good figure, and we are actually quite pleased with that. And that means also the earnings per share for the first 6 months of EUR 0.33. So it's a bonus [indiscernible] compared with last year. Now we come to the next page where I think we're mentioning that we see some sort of regional development in order intake in phase, and this is quite interesting because you can see both on the order side and on the sales side that we have rather strong figures spanning all the regions. And I would say that's partly that's effect now of the projects we've been doing, which has been coming in and on a more high level, but also, which may be even more encouraging than that, the small and medium customers, which previously have been on a rather low level during the corona situation, making a come back now even more or less in a full-fledged way, so that things are -- it's not back to normal so at least from a figure point of view, it looks like this is all normal. If you really point out something, I would say then, and that is very strong order intake, I would say in continental Europe, obviously, comes from catch-up effect there, very strong. And of course, if you go to North America, and you see that this kind of quarter thing is very strong. But the figure, of course, was last year, negatively influenced, of course, by the COVID. So this percentage figures, I would say, it's a bit on the too high side. New markets also relatively grew. So totally approximately 59% to 60%, and then plus the acquisitions, 2020, you come to 84%. If you then look at the same figures for the first half year, you see then that when I talked to that before, again we've clearly be going with, let's call it, 40%, including some currency effects and some acquisitions. So in total, roughly 60%. On the sales side, you see similar development, but also the things which is maybe a little bit deviating there is that -- you see, of course, that North America is doing very well, United Kingdom has also been marching quite much. And they had a lower intake in the first quarter, which will, of course, manifest itself in a higher safety environment during this quarter.So quite a strong development, I would say, in all regions. Here, of course, that a few around higher figures than the rest, but some of those are not as mature as the other one, which you also have to take into consideration. So totally then we have invoiced up to 6 months EUR 122 million. And if you take that to the rolling figure of 12 months, if you see to the right on that picture. You see then that at [indiscernible] EUR 209 million. And on the other side, EUR 230 million, so obviously, if this continues, we're going to make a substantial increase in volume and activity level compared with 2020. Go to the next page. So we tend to give some sort of conclusion. And we have -- just this quarter, as previous quarters, we have received several main orders of different segments. But of course, the really more bigger ones are within automated warehouse, Mission Guarding and we're very pleased with that. And we see most that [indiscernible] some sort of catch-up effect even if you can't -- based on our studies, we also see that small and medium-sized customers have come back now. Hopefully, that will continue. So we think that there was an all-time high development in results in this quarter, which was subjecting of course, the order and safe travel, some good utilization of the manufacturing and you see the growth. Going to United States. Also, I think, which are -- it's important polymer, continuing to develop well. And so we'll continue to improve results. And I would say, specific opportunities is growing substantially and it's probably then approaching [indiscernible] to say, as it goes to summit, if this continues. All factors continue to develop well. There's a continued turbulence with steel price. We don't think that the increase of steel price will continue in the third quarter. Maybe there will be a leveling out in the fourth quarter and hopefully, you can see some stabilization. Maybe sometimes you see it going down during the earlier first quarter next year. But we are calculating with and taking measures that the price will continue to be very turbulent in the remaining part of the year. Integration of Natom is continuing and done in a good way. So we don't see any major problems there. So in total, the development with a substantial;y better result, even if of course, when you compare with the same quarter last year, as I said, it is, of course, negative, influenced by COVID. For the rest, we have some comments normally regarding growth factors. I won't go though that in detail because they don't change from quarter-to-quarter. But one thing I could touch upon what is that, the item 2 or the what is called here, onshoring of manufacturing, which we have seen for, I would say, many years, but maybe we've not had a big influence. But I don't think that, that will have a bigger influence now because we do see, of course, that customers of ours are thinking or realizing that to have many subsuppliers in China is -- could create problems. The lead times are very long. And of course, especially now all of them, and you have also seen that the freight prices are extremely high. So that's taking, of course, away some of the [indiscernible] we are producing there. So I personally for me, the onshoring of the manufacturing, we have increased in Europe and in North America compared with before. Otherwise, what's driving the growth for us is still an increase in industrial automation. And again, if anything has happened after COVID which is positive as you go on automation because it will continue. And the same goes to e-commerce, which, if anything, again, is also taking a new step based on, of course, that we as consumers want to shop online in a much bigger quantity or much bigger way than we did before. Next page shows the estimation of ourselves, the market leader. We don't think that the market has changed so much during between 2018 and 2019. We will, I think, do a new analysis now to work in, in the year so that we can take into account for the strange year of 2020, where obviously the market went down and now we prove positive so far in 6 months, which were heavy markets used to come back to the old levels. Next page shows a little bit of our competitive situation. With our assessment, it's no external company doing it, so we have to do it with our best assessment of the competitive situation. And then moving into the next page, which is our production units, and we added then Poland last year, where we're going to have the capacity of some 500,000 or something like that, and we do intend to increase the capacity of fund was fine. And next page shows some of the different brands that we're working with. And in some cases, some people are very happy with Troax, with some of the cases with some other brands, and we do intend to continue to work with this because we have different product ranges, different or qualities and also different distribution channels. Now moving into a little bit of what we call a Safer Tomorrow, which obviously we've been on since 1955. We, of course, work a lot with sustainability. And I don't think any company cannot sort of work a lot with that today. And we work a lot on, which I said before, not only in compensating for our own transportation, which is the classical one, even if it's not solving perhaps the issue. We will cooperate with the energy consumption. We have regional manufacturing, which decreases transportation and et cetera. We try to work with, of course, with the ISO 14000, try to minimize use of plastic products. And then we have a good point, which is that 99% or maybe even higher, it's recyclable steel and minimum 30%, and we will probably change that to a high figure. We will design them to have recycled steel products. And that, of course, is the main, let's call it, problem when we analyzed the CO2 content that we are giving away to the environment, that's coming from the process of steel. So if we can either help the steel mills or at least buy recyclable steel waste to bigger quantities, then of course, that will help sustainability the for us in a major way, that's much more important actually than what we read in our own factories, even efficient, of course, in any way, neglect what we are doing here to also have, of course, an effect on the environment. Right. Next page, to access the centers where we will do a lot of development work. We also like to see from the next page, a certified by TÃœV Rheinland, which, of course, we say it's very good because that doesn't mean then that the customer not only have to trust Troax and thanks for everything. But actually, we have someone who is certifying us and keeping an eye on us, which I think is very good from a customer point of view. So in a sense, you see here on the next page, we are -- this is our manufacturing in the south that we have, as you saw from the other pictures before, a number of factories now all over the world, more or less. And our aim is supposed to protect people, property and processes. And being the origin [indiscernible] certified, we think that we are best suited to continue to do that. The just to end my presentation, hiring is, of course -- and to protect what measures, obviously, that's the family. So we want to help all the companies to protect the people who are working in the organization. So obviously, they can have safety when the shifts they're working on is over, that's what we're working on. So with this, I am minus my presentation, and I hope I will, as usual, get some very good questions, and I will do my best to answer. So please go ahead.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] And your question comes from the line of Kenneth Toll from Carnegie.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

[indiscernible]

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

I'm sorry, but I hear you very bad. I think there is a bit of a problem.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

Okay. Is it better now?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Yes, it's better now, Ken.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

So yes, so you invested a lot in production capacity a few years ago. But now your growth is very, very strong. So I was wondering, are you getting those to capacity -- of the full capacity utilization. And in that case, how quickly can you expand production capacity more?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Good questions, Kenneth. No, we still have a machine capacity at least available, especially in evals in Hillerstorp and in Italy because there we made some the substantial investment in the last lets call it, 5 years. So we still have some machine capacity over. So we don't short term need to rush want the imminent investments to cover this of course, that because of the very good volume development, that this lacking machine capacity will of course be eaten up to a certain extent, which, of course, is very good and we're happy with it. But the problem from the machine capacity is actually our newly acquired business in Poland, Natom, where this demand coming from Automated Warehouse makes them -- that they actually have to turn away some orders where we are in the process of investing more, but these investments will not come into process due to deliveries of machines until the earliest, end of this year. So there will be, unfortunately, a bit of the deficit, I mean, in that part. But we -- let's call it, the ordinary Troax part does not suffer short term from an problems with machine capacity.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

Okay. Great. And then on feed prices, you talked a little bit about some of increases and that it might affect your margins going forward. But I expected it to -- that it would have affected your earnings in the second quarter. So -- and you are raising prices. So do you think that in that effect, between your own price increases and higher feed cost will be a lot of negative in the third quarter than it was in the second quarter?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

It depends, of course, how to -- what we know today, and I think it will be some sort of similar situation. So hopefully, we can compensate to what they intend to do in the third quarter in a similar way. So that's how we see it. After -- we will see the effect when we talk again in October. But so far, the information we've got, I think we can handle this situation.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

Okay. And finally, so last year, of course, we were negatively affected by the COVID-19, but there might have been some costs but have also been a bit lower such as traveling costs and cost of trade fairs and so on.

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Correct.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

Yes. Yes. So do you think that those kind of costs are increasing in the second half of this year already? Or are you saying of course there's something next year?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

No, you're right. So as an obvious conclusion that cost would be slightly higher in second half of this year, not perhaps so that we will do a lot of the exhibitions and so because we don't -- won't come back until next year. But the traveling will restart and some other cost will come back, will be a little bit higher. And because of the volume increase, I would say, in general, we have to strengthen the organization in certain cases. We are actually then pushing the organization right now with the present volume a little bit to the -- too high, I would say. So we have to do some increases here and there. So of course, we'll have some influence on cost compared to what you see now during the second quarter, at least.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

And that also goes for salespeople? Are you adding salespeople?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Yes, yes. We are adding sales people, correct.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

And finally, the capacity utilization, as I understood it, it is quite evenly spread between the different plants you have in Hillerstorp. Is that true?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

It was true. It has changed a bit now I would say in the last 3, 4 months. So as I tell you on that, there's overcapacity still possibility Hillerstorp and Italy, whereas for we warned you to the increased demand in the last 2 quarters. They're always struggling with capacity problems, some bottlenecks, not maybe generally but some bottlenecks. And as I said, Natom is really up to having no excess capacity basically.

[Kenneth Toll Johansson, Financial Analyst]

And that should mean that profitability for the frozen dollar operation should be better now, maybe even the factory?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Yes. Correct. Utilization of -- for factory refers to be used. You're absolutely correct, Ken.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] And your next question comes from the line of [indiscernible] from Danske Bank.

[Unknown Analyst]

Yes. Thomas. Just the first question will be on your comments regarding the catch-up effects on order intake. And for me, it's hard to understand. So I need a little bit more color on it because you had, of course, A type of order intake before the COVID, between EUR 40 million and I would say, a big mixture of EUR 40 million, EUR 45 million. And then 2 quarters with something like EUR 38 million, and since Q4, almost EUR 60 million in order intake. So why should we still be in a catch-up effect for me, it's already done? Or do you still see that?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Yes, It's also a good question. But I think, given there is some sort of catch-up effect because not only we have seen them, but then small and medium-sized customers have come back during the second quarter. And I brought -- we then done a number of -- of course, maybe not spectacular orders, but nevertheless a number of smaller orders, which obviously has been put an eye then since last year or maybe even earlier. And I think there is a certain effect of that, even if I have said, it's difficult for us as certain as it is. So even if I can't give you a figure, I would still say that made the second quarter figures is slightly on the positive side because of this. But the underlying market is very good. So it's not so that it is -- we're not talking about 30%, 40% or so, but we're talking about some sort of effect, which we estimate is a catch-up effect.

[Unknown Analyst]

And in terms of competition, do you see the competitors are growing as quickly as you? Or are you taking market share because of the COVID situation when it was difficult to deliver on time and other things?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

It's -- we think, that it is our own estimate, but we took market share both last year because of what the exactly what you explained also. But this year, we have clearly been taking of course, market share because we've been processing from these bigger projects where there has not been so many of those out in the market. So obviously, we've been growing more than -- most of our competitors. I think that's a fair fact.

[Unknown Analyst]

Okay. And my last question will be in terms of mix because you are saying that the small clients are coming back, you're giving a positive comments on automotive. I know from the past that you were saying that small clients are always very positive in terms of margin effect. What can you say about the automotive sector? Is it still very competitive, or less?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

No. Automotive is always competitive. I would say that at least for the first part of this year, if anything, it's getting even more competitive because I will answer, we have increased cash restrains, so all liquidity is restrained. And we felt that, that was even tougher with pricing than the automotive than before. And perhaps now that things are getting back, if not to normal, at least some sort of positive development. It will then also normalize and perhaps not become that price sensitive as it was a beginning of this year. So -- but it's been a bit tougher, I would say this year, price-wise. And maybe there will be some slight improvements during second half year because then it's a more positive situation for them as companies.

[Unknown Analyst]

And then maybe last question on M&A. So you did 2 great acquisitions lately and still a strong balance sheet. Are you still looking at some bigger target in APAC? Or do you still see that there are some competitors who are growing and becoming bigger and that might be very interesting for you to buy them? Or is it still a very fragmented market and...

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

APAC is still fragmented market. There are no big competitors at all that you can buy because they don't exist. But there are a number of smaller ones, I would say, 3, 4, 5 of them, which we are interested in. And hopefully, we can get our hands on 1 or 2 of them over time. As regards to the more mature markets in Europe and to say, so North America, we are indeed, of course, always interested to make acquisitions as long as that they are ripe, so to speak, from the strategical point of view. And so if something comes up, we are clearly interested. When something comes up because take 2, 3 years before something really matures, but we are clearly interested. So if anyone out there is interested to sell a good company with [indiscernible], we are really interested.

[Operator]

And your next question comes from the line of Jon Hyltner from Enter.

[Jon Hyltner, Fund Manager of Equities]

First time in a while, you said something positive about the auto industry. Can you elaborate a little bit more, what do you see in terms of bigger projects because we've seen a lot of new car models coming out, but not really big investments in your field. Are those about to come now with all the new models that we see on the market?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

I think, generally speaking, as far as I can understand, there is the financial situation and this problem, which were last year, with a lot of layoffs and then what have you in that type of market have stabilized then. So I think then they look more positively to the future. And that, of course, has impact also on small supplier like us, which has a certain impact on the safety side for their investments. So we have seen and that it started and a positive trend with automotive in North America. And then it came also a bit back in the second quarter now in Europe. We are not seeing so much in APAC or the Far East yet. So we can see that it's coming in different spaces. But we do clearly see then that more and more, at least question, is coming up regarding this kind of safety issues in the investments that we're in. So I would expect then maybe not a straight lining cost in automotive. But I would expect that it is growing step by step, but probably a little bit slower, not any really big increases. And it's based on, of course, their financial situation and general situation has been stabilized. Therefore, you know much better how to handle the different product segments and in hybrids and electrical coils and this is what I view. And of course, they also need to do a lot and based on the explosion, you might call it, on the demand for electrical cars, which, of course, going to invest a lot in. So I have been a little surprised before that the obvious output of electrical cars did not manufacture -- have been a higher input in types of sensing, but it seems to come out, but it was a bit slower than I'm pleased to expect.

[Jon Hyltner, Fund Manager of Equities]

But have you seen any change? Is that perhaps they are better in reusing fences and -- or maybe adapting the production line so that they don't have to...

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Yes, we haven't seen that. It is still so -- I don't think that's changed. But the investment that is in our types of fences is different. It's such a small part of the total CapEx and I don't think there have been a lot of efforts to take that apart and clean it and put it back and then buy some additional parts and what have you they will buy us for. We are seeing complete package really from the, or from their subsupplier, their machine supplier, which supplies the line that they are installing and they will buy that. That thing is because they need to get to your delaying operating in such a short time, and they don't have capacity to do a lot of these small changes that -- which are necessary.

[Jon Hyltner, Fund Manager of Equities]

Okay. Good. And then finally, around what share of sales goes to automotive during this first half of '21?

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

I used to say that last year was 10%, 15%, it was on the low side. I haven't calculated yet on what the first half year will be. It was rather the low for the first quarter and high for the second quarter. So I would say that probably we are coming closer now to 15% of the terminal which is related to automotive.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] We have no further questions at queue. Sir, please continue.

[Thomas Widstrand, CEO, President & Director]

Thank you very much for your interest and for your attention. I appreciate it very much. Of course, as all the questions. I look forward to talk to you again, I mean, in October, something like this or maybe beginning of November when we are them explaining our third quarter results, which, of course, will be interesting if good trend continues or not. We will certainly then -- to have us to fulfill the expectations. Thank you very much for listening and see you. Bye-bye.

[Operator]

Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.