Solutions 30 SE

PAR:S30

Earnings Call Transcript 2019-Q4

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Good afternoon, everybody. I'm Gianbeppi Fortis, CEO of Solutions 30. I'm not alone. We have with us Amaury Boilot, our CFO.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Good afternoon.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

And actually, I leave the floor to Amaury, who is going to begin with Slide 3, to comment our revenues 2019.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Okay. Let's go directly to the figures. So Solutions 30 generated revenue of EUR 685.9 million in 2019. Therefore, 2019 is another year of very strong growth with an acceleration of the growth by 55%, of which 27% is organic, which is actually pretty much in line with the growth we had over the last -- past years.In France, revenue went up by 57%, up to EUR 437.2 million, with a solid organic growth of 21%. And in the other countries, the revenue went up by 36% organically and by 53% in total, reaching EUR 248.7 million.Next, looking now at the figures on Q4 2019, the group posted a total revenue of EUR 200 million, to be compared with the EUR 150.7 million posted in Q4 2018. Revenue went up by 37% in France, where the activity was particularly strong. Actually, the strikes in France, which occurred at the end of the year, had almost no impact on the activities and the organic growth even accelerated in Q4 and reached almost 26%.In the other countries, revenue grew by almost 25%, of which 10.8% is organic. And this revenue went up from EUR 57.4 million in Q4 2018, up to EUR 71.8 million in Q4 2019.Next, the strong growth delivered by Solutions 30 Group in 2019 is still relying on the 2 pillars of our growth model. The first pillar is actually our positioning of the dynamic markets of digital equipments, which explains the 21% organic growth in France and the 35% organic growth in the other countries.The second pillar of the strategy is actually our M&A strategy because we want to consolidate the markets we are operating in. So in France, the last acquisition that we made, namely CPCP, Sotranasa and very recent acquisition, Byon, contributed for a total amount of EUR 98.6 million to the group revenue in 2019.And as you can see, we made a number of acquisitions in different countries. We made -- we acquired Saltó and Provisiona in Spain. We acquired I-Projects Group in the Netherlands. We acquired 70% of CFC in Italy. And lately, we acquired a subsidiary of Sprint in Poland. All of these companies contributed for EUR 27.3 million to the group revenue.Next. So on the following slide, you can see how the different business lines contributed to the growth that was posted on Q4 in France. Well, as you can see, the telecom business was a significant contributor to this very positive trend, with a 67% growth over the last 3 months. Actually, the fiber deployment has now started in the less dense areas. And as we already announced, Solutions 30 won significant contracts in this field. And these new contracts have started progressively since September. And they are still now in a ramp-up phase.Regarding the energy activity, well, revenue went up by 24% up to EUR 24.3 million in Q4. This growth is mainly in line with the deployment of gas and electricity smart meters with development of the maintenance activity, which is a business that we develop, thanks to the capability acquired with Sotranasa, and is also related to the start of the deployment of the charging stations for electrical vehicles. Regarding the IT and retail segments, which accounts respectively for 9% and 3% of the French revenue over this quarter, they are actually decreased a little bit. But actually, this is mainly explained by the good performance that we had in Q4 2018, where revenue were a bit boosted by significant deployments in this period. But if you compare the figures, the revenue we had for this business lines in Q4, they are pretty much in line with the revenue we had over the last quarters.Next, on the next slide, well, basically, you see that the trends we have commented are very similar on a year-to-date basis. Revenue went up from EUR 279.1 million in 2018, up to EUR 437.2 million in 2019, mainly under the influence of the booming activity of Telecom which grew by 91% in 2019, and the energy activity which grew by 56% in 2019.Next.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Okay. Maybe I go can make a couple of comments here. But basically, it's something that Amaury has already spoken about. Some people had doubts about the potential of the telecommunications market in France because it's quite mature, but what you are seeing is that the growth is still strong. It's related to the aggressiveness of the main operators in the country that are fighting to gain market share and also by the new projects. Thus the local municipalities are running to take the fiber to the countryside. And these projects have just begun. So they are not very significant in the numbers of 2019. They will be visible from 2020, and they are going to last for a few years. So we are still extremely positive on the growth that we can have in France in the telecom market for 2020 and the years to come.It's the same with Linky, these smart meters in France had been deployed at a very a fast rate. We already said and investors know that we will reach at peak in 2020, but what we are seeing is that there are some smaller players in this market that begin to have difficulties to keep up with the pace of deployment. So we may have good opportunities to increase our market share in these markets. So we remain positive on the evolution of the energy sector in France because we believe that while the deployment of Linky overall may slow down a bit, we can compensate that with the additional market share we can gain.And on top of that, we have begun in 2019 to deploy charging stations. We expect this activity to be visible in our revenues in 2020 in France, but also in other countries.And on top of that, we still see potential for consolidation. We have done some deals in the past. And we keep open to similar acquisitions in France and also in the other countries pretty much the same as what we have done for the past 10 years now. Next, please.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Well, if we now look at the development of the revenue in the other countries over the last 3 months of 2019, what we see is that the revenue reached EUR 71.8 million over the last quarter. The revenue actually increased by 20% in Germany. So we had an acceleration of the organic growth in Germany, which is mainly explained by 2 effects. The first one is related to the extension of our activity with the 3 main telecom operators in Germany and the second one is the start of our diversification in this country since we won first contracts in the energy market at the end of 2019 in Germany.In Benelux, revenue reached EUR 37.1 million, up 23% in comparison with Q4 2018. The group is currently pursuing the same diversification strategy that we have in France. And actually, we even extended our operations in the Netherlands notably with the acquisition of I-Projects Group, which is the company specialized in the energy business.In Spain, well, the business remained very dynamic. This is mainly explained by our increased positioning in the telecom business, notably for the installation and maintenance of fast internet network and also by -- for the installation of 5G equipment.In Italy, well, the revenue growth only reached plus 8%. This is mainly explained because the group decided at the end of 2019 to terminate the contract with DXC Technology. We made this choice in order to better allocate our resources on segments with greater potential in terms of growth and profitability. Just to mention that this operation will have no impact on our profitability in 2019. Next. Now you have a view on the year-to-date figures in these countries. Well, what you can see is that the growth was very dynamic in all the countries with a significant impact resulting from the contract that we signed with Telenet since, as you can see, Belgium revenue is now over EUR 100 million, which is an important milestone for us. And as a result of this, Belgium now -- Belgium and Netherlands now account for almost 90.6% of the group revenue -- 19, sorry, 19.6%.Well, next.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Okay. A few comments from my side. Benelux is the second geography where we are above EUR 100 million, which is one of the symbolic -- it's really a symbolic target that we like to reach in each of the geographies. So we have proven that we are capable to achieve it, not only in France, but also in other places.We have signed a big contract with Telenet last year, actually 2 years ago, implemented last year. But the growth potential of this geography remains strong. It's actually a geography where we have begun deploying charging stations for electrical vehicles. They are more advanced than Southern Europe. And this growth will continue in 2020.On the other side, on the other important verticals for our, which is -- for us, which is fiber and 5G and meters, they're a little bit behind, in particular in Belgium. But that's good for us because it allows us to prepare. So we are in talks with utilities for the deployment of smart meters. We are getting close of course with Telenet to see how we can help them to deploy 5G. And we are also talking to the fixed line operators to add them on the fiber deployment.Spain has a very dynamic economy where we see very good potential on both fixed and mobile networks for the operators. FTTH has a quite high penetration rate in Spain, but there is still a lot to do with Masmovil still investing and with good opportunities with Vodafone and Orange, thanks to the context we have in other countries.And it's the same for charging station for electrical vehicles. We are now running projects also in Spain. And we see that what happened already in Benelux is coming down to Spain as well.Italy, I would say, is the least dynamic economy. As Amaury said, we prefer not to continue our relationship with DXC and to allocate our resources elsewhere as well, I mean, on 5G projects. 5G is coming to Italy, so we are trying to be ready for that. And we also see opportunities in a market that is consolidating. It's taking time because of the political situation, but we really believe that the country will begin investing in telecommunication infrastructure. And we also believe that when that will begin, there will be a concentration of the market, of which we will be part. So that's the reason why we prefer to concentrate our resources in this.In Germany, Amaury already said that we have begun deploying smart meters. We have several discussions for the deployment of charging stations. And the telecom activity is going well with us being the only provider working both for Unitymedia and Vodafone and adding a lot of work in the south because Vodafone is moving its clients to the Unitymedia network.And the other good piece of good news is that Poland has begun well with the 2 acquisitions that are under control, so no bad signals from there, and also with a very good relationship with Orange, our historical client, that is really willing to see us grow in the country.Next. So we remain positive for 2020. Basically, we are closing 2019 very well. And this means that we are beginning 2020 also very well. As you know, we do not like to give short-term targets, but we are confident saying that also in 2020 there will be a good year of double-digit growth, and this is not including additional acquisitions that we may do in 2020. And we also confirm our midterm target to reach EUR 1 billion of revenues.For the convenience of all of the investors, we also listed in the same page the acquisitions made in 2019 and the last one done in Poland, 1st January 2020, with the current revenues -- with the revenues of this acquisition at the moment we made the deal. Next.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Regarding our IFRS transition, we just want to confirm that everything is on track on our side. We are currently closing 2019 in IFRS, and we will release the financial statements in IFRS, which is actually the last bridge that is required in order to finalize our prospectus for our move to Euronext.Next. Regarding the IFRS impact, well, we already commented that, and there is no changes expected. I will mainly focus on IFRS 16, which is a standard related to revenue recognition since we are talking today about revenue.As we disclosed, the impact of IFRS 16 should be very limited on the 2019 revenue and should be lower than EUR 3 million. This impact is mainly related to 2 small parts of our activity. The first impact is related to the leasing of payment terminal, which is a small activity because actually under Lux GAAP we are recognizing the revenue progressively. We are just recognizing the revenue included in the monthly rates that we invoiced. But under IFRS, you need to recognize revenue, the full revenue at the start of the contract as if we have sold this equipment. But this generate a small positive impact. And then the second significant impact is mainly related to another small part of our activity, which can be assimilated to project work, where the change in work in progress should be included in the revenue. Currently, under Lux GAAP, this revenue are included in the other income. And in IFRS, they are included in the revenue. So at the end of the day, it is all matter of presentation, but this will have no impact on our bottom line. Well, I think we are done with this presentation, and we can now leave the floor for your questions.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] And we will take our first question from Anna Patrice from Berenberg.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Yes, hello. Congratulations on a very good result.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Thank you.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Couple of questions -- a couple of questions, sorry, on my side. Can you comment on factoring how this is going on the pace if there was increase or decrease and how the working capital is? But in H1, there was quite a good development on the working capital.On the new contracts, are those contracts in line with the French overall margins? Are they accretive or dilutive? How should we think about it?And then on Italy, it seems like there was a bit of volatile development over the last few years. Is it because the country chose to dismount or you were more kind of focusing on the large opportunities? Or -- what's going in Italy? And what's [ the reality ] going forward?And then last question for the time being.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

That's more than 2, Anna.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Okay. Fine.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. The last one.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

So the last question is actually on the smart meters in France because you were saying that it should kind of peak and then come down a bit. So where do you see -- how do you see it going forward for 2020 in France?

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Okay. Well, regarding your first question on cash factoring. Well, the -- we kept using the same policy. So basically, you will have at the end of the year, an outstanding amount factoring, which is basically 1 month of revenue, which is in line with our practices.In terms of working capital, it's maybe a little bit early to give you some figures since we are only talking about revenue today, but you can expect some dilution effect coming from the acquisitions that we made on H2 on the working capital.I think that's for the first question.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

That's okay for you. And sorry, you had the second part of the question was revenue related to new contract? I didn't get it right. Can you repeat, Anna?

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Yes. So in France, you have new contracts. And those new contracts in France, what are the margins? Are those fully integrated and hence they are actually margin accretive because you can utilize your employees better? Or they are dilutive maybe because they are new areas where the density is lower? So if you can comment on how the -- how do you see the margin development in France going forward?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

I would say, we will stay on a positive trend, meaning margins going up simply because we have a very strong position in the country. And basically, new activities have an impact on average EBITDA of the group.At the same time, we still need to do ramp-ups. So it's something that you can see overall on a 12-month basis. So over 12 months, margin will go up. On a quarterly basis, maybe less so if we have in the quarter a larger ramp-up. So I would say, overall in '20, positive impact on the margins coming from France.And then I think you had a question concerning Italy. Well, in Italy, it's not easy to read the local situation, especially because of politics and the big clients we told to, of course, are influenced by that.But DXC is a different thing. I don't know if you have read the news about this company. It's not -- I'm not sure that it's the kind of strategic client we can bet on for the coming 3 to 5 years. We gave it a try. And then we have considered the other options that we have in the country in 2020 and basically decided to allocate our resources to the things that have more potential and, therefore, are higher priorities.So you shouldn't see it as a country-related thing, but I would say it's more a wise utilization of our resources in places where there is potential.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Okay. Understood. On -- sorry, on the margin -- yes. Okay, go ahead.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

That was on smart meters. On the margin concerning Italy, no negative impact. Basically, we sold the activity to a smaller company that was interested in making a profit on doing that. That's all.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Yes. No, no, sorry. I wanted to follow up on the margins in France because I understand that the growth in France should be positive for the group margins. But the new contracts in France, are they also positive for the French margins or not so much if the French margins remain where they were before? Or are they fully dilutive to the French margin?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

There is no positive, no positive contribution on the margins in France.

[Anna Patrice, Analyst]

Okay. Understood. And maybe also a follow-up on the margin question because you flagged that in Benelux you have exceeded EUR 100 million sales mark. So do you see that also your margins are improving there? And are they closer to the French ones? Or there is still some more room for improvement?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Yes. Well, today, we are doing revenues. But yes, you should expect an increase coming also from that side because we now have the size that is good for that geography.Let me go to the last question you had, which was smart meters in France. Overall, the market, the French market, electricity meters, reached a peak in terms of speed of deployment in 2019.So in 2020, the overall market will be a bit smaller than what it was in '19. But it's not a big drop. It's a small drop. And what we are seeing is 2 things. We have new activities in the energy sector related to charging stations for the car related to additional investments that the energy distributors had to do to improve the condition of their distribution network. And also, because and that's what I said before, now this market is "mature," and there are some small players that are having hard time going to the end of this market.So we believe that we can also gain some market share in these markets, which means that you should not expect in 2020 a decrease of our energy activities in France.

[Operator]

We will now take our next question from Anthony Dick from Portzamparc.

[Anthony Dick;Portzamparc;Analyst]

I had 3. My first question was concerning the revenue per technology. Could you maybe give a breakdown of what kind of revenue you generated from FTTH activities from 5G and from EV charging stations? And what kind of revenue you expect from these new business lines in 2020? You said it was going to be visible, but what kind of order of magnitude can we expect from 5G and charging stations in 2020?And my second question concerned M&A. So you've done a bunch of M&A this year. I wondered what capacity remains in terms of M&A. I mean obviously this is not a cash flow call, but can we expect a similar level rhythm of M&A in 2020? Do you still have that kind of capacity?And my final question was a quite technical one on the contribution of the recent acquisition of Byon in 2019 and also what kind of revenue can we expect from this new business because there's EUR 14 million of contracts, but do you expect more? I mean, what kind of run rate revenues are to be expected from this acquisition?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

I think I can take most of that, maybe not the part with breakdown of fiber and other things inside our revenues. But what I can say is that in '19, the 5G activities have been very small. We have begun basically in the last quarter in Spain. And I would say that in '20 we can expect -- I'm broad when I talk here, but I would say less than EUR 10 million, at the beginning in all of the geographies. Charging stations can be above EUR 10 million. So ballpark figures may be EUR 10 million, EUR 15 million. That's what we can expect in 2020.Concerning M&A, we still have firepower. So expect in 2020 something similar to what we have done in the last, actually 10 years. So it's pretty much the same. 2020 is going to be pretty much the same. Concerning Byon, the company has signed EUR 40 million of contracts, that's not being produced yet. But we have just begun doing some activities on these contracts at the end of 2019. So there is most part of that, that is going to be done in the next 3 years.Same as the other announcement that we have done 1 or 2 months ago, where we announced having gained EUR 40 million of deployments in France. That's also an activity that is going to begin in 2020 and then last for 3 years.Concerning the breakdown...

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Concerning the breakdown of FTTH activities, your -- well, in the telecom business line, FTTH generated a revenue of slightly above EUR 200 million in 2019.

[Anthony Dick;Portzamparc;Analyst]

Okay. Is that in France or also overall at the group level?

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Yes. In France. In France.

[Anthony Dick;Portzamparc;Analyst]

In France. Okay. And maybe just a last question concerning growth and your outlook on growth. So you expect double-digit growth next year. Is that double-digit organic growth or total growth?

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

It's total growth. Actually, you can expect double-digit growth even in the major geographies. And we'll continue to deliver the same strategy, meaning that half of this growth will be -- will come from external growth.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

But then when we say this, the nonorganic growth comes from acquisitions already done. And then on top of that, there will be other bolt-on M&A that come on top, we believe. Next.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions]

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Okay. So we had some questions. First question comes from Olivier Parein from Crystal Management about the guidance for 2020. So this is mainly related to the formal questions that we answered.So as explained, you can expect double-digit growth in all the geographies next year, combining external and organic growth. So this is mainly the same question.Next question comes also from Olivier Parein. How likely are you to enter a new country in 2020? Which ones are you considering?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Yes, I can take this one. I think last time we had investors calls where we said that we have done Poland, and then we are very busy with the current geographies. We also said that we like large geographies. And the last one in Europe that is left is U.K., and we were a little bit reluctant looking at the U.K. because of Brexit.I would say that now the situation is much clear. And I would say the carbon risk is excluded, I would say. And what we are seeing is that, apparently, U.K. is organizing the country to foster local economy with investments. So that's a very interesting signal for us. So I'm not saying that we are going to do the U.K. in 2020. I'm not saying that, but I'm saying that we are now analyzing in detail the potential of the U.K. market. And if conditions are met, then we will enter it, following a strategy very similar to what we have done already in other countries and in particularly, in Poland, trying to select an anchor client that would allow us to begin and then in parallel looking for small bolt-on acquisition.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Okay. So we are taking all the questions coming from the webcast. The next one comes from Charles-Louis Planade from Midcap. So the question is, can you confirm that there is no capital increase plan when you will realize the transfer on Euronext?Yes, we confirm that it's just a technical transfer from Euronext growth to Euronext without any operations on our equity.So then we have a question again on the webcast coming from Charles Lepetitpas from ODDO. In Q4, growth in France telecom's unit was very strong. What portion of growth is related to the RIP or public initiative networks? Do you expect similar growth rate in Q1 2020 or stronger as these contracts are ramping up?Well, actually, these public initiatives contracts actually contributed to 1/4 of the growth over this quarter. And we can expect this activity to grow again at the beginning of 2020.So the next question comes from Benjamin Terdjman from Kepler Cheuvreux. In which countries do you see the strongest organic growth this year? And in which ones can we expect significant acquisitions?Well, actually, obviously, it will be easier to grow faster in the countries where we are small, but we expect solid growth in all the geographies. Obviously, Poland will have a strong growth rate. I would say that basically we see all these geographies growing with similar -- at a similar pace as we had over the last years.In which ones can we expect significant acquisitions? Well, actually, the current pipe is quite full. We have acquisitions that we are currently studying in different countries. So we'll continue to acquire companies in all the countries. No specific one.So then we have a question coming from [Foreign Language]. Could you please give us some color on the current trends in Eastern Europe and notably Poland, please?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Okay. I can pick this up. Poland is a very interesting geography for us. First of all, because the country is at 3%, 4% yearly GDP growth. So it's a very healthy economy with now quite low unemployment rate. And actually, it's a place where we -- where our technicians very often come from Ukraine which is close. So dynamic economy.And inside this economy, the national operator is Orange, which is a company we know extremely well. This is, of course, leading the investments in fiber and soon also in 5G. The country has also interesting projects in the energy sector. Basically, we would see in Poland the same trend we have seen in France with, I would say, 4, 5 years delay.The market is also extremely fragmented. Our competitors are quite weak. Most of them are very old-fashioned family businesses. So we still see a very good potential for concentration. And Poland is also benefiting from subsidies that come from the European community to -- as the country to invest in infrastructure, telecommunications and energy and, of course, all kind of infrastructure. So we are extremely positive in Poland. We believe that we will see a good trend of growth and profitability in Poland.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Well, then we have a question from [ Carlos Serini from RSD Partners.] How big is your buying power for acquisitions?Well, actually, we currently use less than EUR 90 million from our current structured credits that we have in place with our banking partners. And we have a credit line of -- in total of EUR 130 million for the moment. That means that we have more than EUR 40 million available that is already authorized by our bank in addition to our cash available to make this acquisition. So that is more than we need currently for the small acquisitions that we are targeting.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

I would also add that our leverage is still low. So we still have a lot of room for leveraging a little bit more of the company if need be for doing the acquisitions. So the constraint for the acquisitions will not be the cash. It will be more our capability to do everything both organic and through acquisitions.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Okay. Then we have a question from [Foreign Language]. What was the cause of the decline in the IT segment in France in 2019? How do you see this segment performing over the next year? Will you seek for M&A opportunities or concentrate on energy and telecom?Well, actually, as I explained, the decline in this segment was actually not a decline if you compare the figures with the last quarters. It was more a question of comparison with Q4 2018, which was actually very strong, because we had some specific and significant deployments at the end of 2018, which contributed to an acceleration of the growth at the end of the year. So this is more a base effect.We are -- IT segment is still a very tragic segment for us. We are considering some M&A opportunities in this segment. But even from an organic perspective, we see this business going up in 2020.Then we have another question from [Foreign Language]. Will 5G be significant in 2020? And in what countries, next to Spain, will you be active on this?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

So yes, so 5G is a strategic market for us all across Europe. Spain is the most advanced, but now there is a second wave of deployment that is coming to other countries. I would say the most advanced after Spain are Italy, Germany, Holland. Belgium is a little bit behind. And Poland is also a little bit behind. But basically, this is a deployment that is going to arrive everywhere. As I said, in other occasions, every country has between 20,000 and 70,000 stations that are currently used for 4G. By the way, there is still investment in 4G because in certain countries there is still some white spots.And that -- what we have seen is that, as soon as the operators are awarded the frequencies for the 5G, they begin upgrading the existing sites. So I'm not talking about microcells. I'm just talking about equipping and the upgrading the existing sites with what is called 4G Plus, which is basically an improvement of the current 4G functionalities, still waiting for the 5G terminals being available which is not the case in most of the countries. So we are seeing this wave of deployment that is coming all across Europe. Of course, we have already excellent relationship with most of the European operators. And now we have begun working also with the main manufacturers, in particular, Ericsson and Nokia, in Spain. And we are trying to now extend these same contracts all across Europe. So I would say that between 2020 and 2021, we will be 5G all across Europe.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Then we have a question from Charles-Louis Planade from Capital Midcap. Can you elaborate more on charging stations for revenues and clients?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Yes. I think I made a comment on the revenue saying that we should be above EUR 10 million on charging stations in Europe in 2020. I'm not sure I know all the companies that we are working with at the moment, but there is a few I'm sure of. It's ATS where we have been selected as a reference partner for all of the residential clients. We have begun working for Total. We are working with Alfen. We are working with Eneco in Benelux. And then we have talks and as an active sales activity with Shell, with [ Ager ], with Innogy in Germany with lots of leasing companies, with some car manufacturers. So basically, it's a market that is extremely dynamic with lots of new entrants and lots of established companies that are trying to find their place. And therefore, we have a very active commercial activity. We see it as an extremely dynamic market in 2020 for the years to come.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Next question is coming from [ Patrick Burr.] Do you intend to have a physical meeting for your 2020 year results?Yes, we confirm that we will have a physical meeting even for our 2019 financial results.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

Which is going to be at the end of April.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

In April -- end of April. Then we have a question from [Foreign Language]. Do you see a market opportunity in the maintenance of the new electronic scooter companies that are flourishing in Europe?

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

It's a difficult one. It's a segment that we have seen, so we are studying it. We are just not sure that we are well equipped to be a significant player in this space. There is already strong companies, mature companies, that are very well present in the market of cars and scooters with networks of garages and shops all across our geographies. So yes, definitely, it's part of the segments that we are analyzing. Still not sure whether it makes sense or not for us.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Okay. Then we have a question from Charles Lepetitpas from ODDO. Why would you look for new acquisitions in France while you already have a large base of customers?Well, actually, we are considering all the countries. Obviously, our first objective is to reach a critical size in all the countries. So we are very active in the monitoring of M&A targets in the other countries than France.But we can have some opportunities -- very interesting opportunities in France and the market seems very fragmented. And if we think we can make a good deal, then we will not exclude the opportunity.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

And also, if we see that our clients want to reduce the number of suppliers they have and there is a concentration, we may be willing to consider doing some external growth. Sometimes it's just faster to get the concentration done.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Then we have a question from Benjamin Terdjman from Kepler Cheuvreux. Do you anticipate a return to growth in the IT segment in France? What could be the catalyst?Well, actually, yes, we -- this market is not growing as fast as the Telecom or Energy segment, but the business is going well. Sales developments are also, we have a strong sales pipe. We signed a new contract with [ SNCF ] at the end of 2019. And our main customers are very happy with the quality we are delivering, and we are extending the relationship with significant clients such as Renault or Fujitsu Field Services. So we can expect this revenue to grow in 2020.Okay. Then we have a question from Jan Richard from Berenberg. On fiber, how much revenues in absolute terms in France in 2018, '19? And what do you expect for 2020?Well, actually, we had a revenue of almost EUR 130 million related to FTTH activities in 2018. It was slightly above EUR 200 million in 2019. And this revenue will continue to increase double digits next year. I -- just for a matter of precision, these figures include the installation of new clients as well as the maintenance activity related to fiber. Then we have a question from Jan Richard from Berenberg. What other areas should you support growth? And where is the biggest opportunity in the near term in absolute terms? What should be the main growth drivers in 2020?Well, actually, if we look at all the countries, well, Telecom will remain a very strong driver of our growth at group level. It's still a significant part of our activity in most countries, and we want to go in that direction in Italy, notably which will remain a very strong growth driver.Energy is starting -- just starting in Germany. It would not be a big driver of growth at group level in Germany. But all the initiatives that are led also in the north of Europe, especially in the Netherlands in the energy business, in Belgium, in France also with start of the installation, makes me say that the Energy segment will remain very dynamic next year and will be a very strong driver for the growth also. And we are still considering all our segments, investing in all our segments. So even if the growth is not as strong, all the segments should grow next year.

[Gianbeppi Fortis, Co]

I'll just add -- yes, I would say that slightly differently, but basically, '19 has been the fourth year in a row where we grew by about 50%. So we are in a situation where we are seeing excellent growth opportunities everywhere. And then it's just a matter of us being capable to catch in all. And it's the same with M&A. We have a pipe that is quite well filled up, and we have firepower. So again, it's more us being capable to catch all the opportunities. So we are very happy with the way 2019 developed. And we believe that 2020 can be, again, very similar to the previous years.We have one last question from Anthony Dick, Portzamparc on outsourcing deals. Any news on outsourcing deals?Well, we have some very active discussions with a certain number of companies, I would say, 5 to 10. Again, it's a question that we get quite regularly. So we are active, and we are trying to push the model that has proven to be very good for both us and our clients with Telenet in Benelux. But again, these discussions take time. So definitely, we will do similar deals in the future. And how fast? I'm still not sure.Okay. We -- I think we are done. We don't have any more questions. We would like to thank you very much. Thank you for your attention and your confidence, and we look forward to talking again to you soon. Bye.

[Amaury Boilot, Group CFO & Member of Executive Board]

Thank you very much.