Aeroports de Paris SA
PAR:ADP
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Aeroports de Paris SA
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Hello, and welcome to Groupe ADP 2020 Nine Month Revenue. My name is Stefano, and I will be your coordinator for today's event. Please note this conference is being recorded. [Operator Instructions]I will now hand over to host, Philippe Pascal, to begin today's conference. Thank you.
Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for attending our first 9 months 2020 revenue conference call.So as you know, air transport was abruptly interrupted from April to June as a result of the containment measure and border closure, decided by most countries, including France, around the world to limit the spread of COVID-19 epidemic. So as you know, we have a huge impact in terms of traffic during this year. And we expect gradual recoveries, depends on the lifting of the mobility restriction measure applicable in each country.So when you see the Slide 1 about the traffic figures for the Groupe ADP, we can see that over the first 9 months of 2020, the group's traffic fell by 61.8% with a total of 72.3 million passengers. For Paris Aéroport, the platform of Groupe ADP in Paris, we have a huge decrease by 66.3% with 27.8 million passengers.Regarding Groupe's ADP international platform and regarding scheduled commercial traffic, a large part of airports are now open to all type of commercial flights. Of course, some local restriction may apply. In Delhi and in Hyderabad Airport, all -- both airports are now open for domestic flights and international flights, only with the countries India signed bilateral agreements. So the activity of Antananarivo, Nosy Be and Santiago de Chile remain at this time limited to domestic traffic.In Slide 2, we have the traffic figure of Paris Aéroport. You can see that traffic at Paris Aéroport is down by 63.3% over the first 9 months of 2020 compared to the first 9 months of 2019. So we can see also that in Paris were the smaller decrease compared to our competitors compared to London, Amsterdam and Frankfurt. Aircraft movements at Paris Aéroport are down by 56.8% compared to the first 9 months of 2019. We try to have a flexible and agile monitoring of our infrastructure to reopen step-by-step, in particular, in Paris-Charles de Gaulle and in Paris-Orly.To be very complete, I can give you some figures for the beginning of October 2020 between the 1st and the 20 October 2020. The estimated decline of passenger traffic reached 75.9%. And our estimation for aircraft movement at the Parisian platform decreased 60.1% compared to the same period in 2019. So we can see a decline and a new strong decrease at the end of September, at the beginning of October. It's the consequences of the new wave of epidemic around the world including in Europe and in France.Slide 3. We can see that if you compare our performance in Paris between the other international platform of the Groupe, we can see the period from 1 -- the 1st January and the end of September, traffic at Paris Aéroport was down by 66.3% compared to 66% for Groupe ADP. So we are globally at the same level in France and in the overall international platform of Groupe ADP. But when you see the recovery, we can see a more dynamic recovery in our international platform, if you compare with the Parisian platform.Slide 4, we can see our figures for the revenue of ADP -- Groupe ADP. Over the first 9 months of 2020, revenue for the Aviation segment, which has only included Parisian activities -- aviation activities is down by 53.2% at EUR 686 million. It does not vary in the same proportion as the passenger traffic. It's mainly due to the effect of airport safety and security tax.On retail activities, our revenue are also penalized by the drop in traffic and the closure of infrastructure. But the sales per pax of airside shops reached EUR 18.6 over the first 9 months of 2020. So performance slightly down by 2% compared to the same period in 2019. So it's not a good performance, but we will limit the crash of this system.For TAV was a decrease in revenue of BTA and TAV OS due to the impact of the crisis, especially in the new Istanbul Airport. And the decrease in revenue of [indiscernible] due to the decline of flight sales and the decrease in revenue of TAV, Georgia, notably following the decline in traffic, but also the air travel restriction in Georgia.For Georgia, we can see a decrease in revenue of EUR 134 million compared to the last year. Globally, over the first 9 months of 2020, we can see our consolidated revenue decreased by 52.7%.When you see the last slide, Slide 5, we can see our new guidance. The resurgence of the epidemic in France, but also in Europe and around the world has led us to revise our traffic assumption for Paris Aéroport. Thus, for Paris Aéroport for the moment in 2020 downward from 63% to a range of 65% to 70% compared to 2019. Moreover, the Groupe confirmed that traffic for Paris Aéroport could return to the level reached in 2019 between 2024 and 2027.Our forecast for the consolidated revenue for the year of 2020 is, therefore, situated in a range of EUR 2.3 billion to EUR 2.6 billion compared to 2019.Groupe ADP continued to implement its optimization plan, operational and financial, with an accentuated objective of reducing OpEx for this year in order of EUR 650 million to EUR 700 million in total compared to our previous guidance.Groupe ADP remains a solid cash position, ensuring a sufficient level of liquidity. So for the moment, we are very comfortable in terms of cash position. Groupe ADP are very mobilized to optimize all our operational and financial position to adapt step-by-step our infrastructure, but also our OpEx to manage this difficult period.So thank you. I am now available for your question.
[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from the line of Elodie Rall from JPMorgan.
Yes. Can you hear me?
Yes. Hello?
So I'll start with -- so first question on testing. We've seen the news on the latest -- like the possibility of implementing rapid COVID test at your airports. I think the results are given in 15, 20 minutes. So how do you expect this to affect air traffic development from here? And did you take that into account already in your new traffic guidance? So that's my first question.Second question would be on cost. So you've increased guidance for CapEx reduction. How much of that do you think is sustainable going forward? How much of that would you expect to come back when traffic growth resumes?And last question on international strategy. So you expect some capital injection at AIG. Are there any other airports where you feel there's going to be also a need of capital injection? And is this crisis hindering your view on strategy in international development? Do you think you would want to maybe look at divesting some assets or you're comfortable with your portfolio and your strategy going forward?
So thank you for your questions. So first question about the testing. So as you know, we are very mobilized to implement this test in our platform, especially in Paris. So Augustin de Romanet is called, right, each day with the Prime Minister of France about that, and we can launch the test and the implementation of this test. Antigen test, but also PCR test in a few days. And in fact, we expect more confidence for all the passengers and probably good effect in the traffic level, but not at the moment, not immediately. We are to prepare the recovery probably at the -- for the summer season in April.So we take now, we implement, we give more confidence for all the passenger. We try to convince all the countries around the world to adopt this kind of test because the question, it's not this testing, the question is to convince all the countries that the test -- the antigen test or the PCR test in Paris will allow good travel without quarantine in the country -- in the arrival country.So that is a huge work for us to convince the French authority, and now we are very proud to give you -- to announce that it's now possible in Paris Aéroport to launch this test. It's a huge work to convince the European authorities because for the moment, we don't have a lot of countries around the world and especially in Europe to adopt this test.And after, we have to announce and to give more confidence for all the passengers with special communication. So for the moment, in our guidance for 2020 and probably for the first quarter of 2021, we don't expect a huge effect. But we expect -- we prepare the huge recovery probably in April in 2021.For the CapEx reduction and the OpEx reduction. So in terms of CapEx reduction, we know that we -- in terms of CapEx reduction, we try to manage the situation. And we know that we announced a strong decrease with CapEx for the next -- for this year but also for '21 and '22 for -- between of EUR 500 million and EUR 600 million for '21 and '22. '21, probably EUR 500 million or EUR 600 million. And '22, probably a little bit lower.In -- for -- we try to manage this situation because we have a specific CapEx that it's not possible to cancel because we have regulatory rules. We have to prepare the recovery of the traffic. So it's not possible to stop all the CapEx. And we choose to finish our main infrastructure to be able to prepare this recovery.In terms of OpEx reduction, we announced reinforcement of this savings. And probably, we have to close new infrastructure in the coming weeks in Orly and in Charles de Gaulle. We don't expect a huge -- we don't expect an increase in terms of traffic before the end of March.I give you some figures about the performance for the beginning of October. It's a very, very bad performance in terms of traffic. We have a strong decrease in our traffic at the beginning of -- at the end of September, at the beginning of October. So we have to adapt all our infrastructure to be able to reduce our costs between now and the end of March to wait the recovery.In terms of injection of capital for AIG. We -- as you know, Groupe ADP is a shareholder of AIG. That is the concessionary company of Amman Airport in Jordan. We want to support our subsidiaries. And so we decide with all our partners a specific shareholder loan for EUR 20 million before the restructuration of this concession and we start to discuss with the Jordan government to be able to have a good restructuration to give more comfort to this concession that is in huge difficulty.We -- for the concession around the world, we have a potential injection. It's for the moment, we have just one point about TAV Tunisia, but it's a contractual solution that we prepare. And -- but it's not an injection, but we have probably further impairment compared to H1, in particular, in TAV. It's a little bit early to speak about that. We are not ready to give you some figures. But probably, we have a [ mixed ] impairment in H2. So thank you for your question.
The next question is coming from Ruxandra Haradau-Doser from Kepler Cheuvreux.
Philippe, 3 questions, please. First, coming back to the testing. With the current number of infections and the flu season starting in Europe, the general demand for testing in France and Europe will probably be very high over the next months. And there will not be significant testing capacities for the aviation sector. Is the government giving you comfort at this stage that they will be able to provide testing capacities to offer them to large scale at airports during the next summer?Second, you started again activities at Paris-Orly as of July, and I understand that most of the infrastructure at the airport is operating since the end of August. If traffic during the winter flight schedule remains below the level of August and September, do you have the opportunities to shut down again Paris-Orly? Could you please give us some indication what your monthly cash burn at Paris Aéroport would be during winter flight schedule at 20% level of activities versus last year?
So Ruxandra, thank you for your questions. So first question about the testing. So you know that we have an internal team in Paris Aéroport in CDG, but also in Orly with a medical team that is -- and in this medical team, we have enough equipment, enough people, enough test to be able to provide comfort to our passenger.We prepare this authorization -- we start to prepare this kind of strategy at the beginning of the summer. So we are now ready, 3 months after, to apply this strategy. We have enough tests, and we just wait the administrative authorization. And I am very happy to be -- to give you the comfort that we are now -- we have now this authorization.So for -- we have an internal team. So we don't depend about over [indiscernible]. We have a specific agreement with a medical external team that is [indiscernible] that it's possible to implement in a short-term this test.For Orly, as you know, when you see the market for the passenger in Paris, the huge market is not in the center of Paris. It's in the South of Paris with South and West of Paris. So Orly -- the location of Orly, it's at the heart of the market. So it's more rational to open Orly if we want to develop an extra traffic.If we close Orly, to put all the traffic in CDG, probably, we have less passenger. Because we have to go to the airport in 1 or 2 hours, not at the heart of the market. CDG, it's very performance platform for connecting passenger, but also for the international flight. When we have a huge part of your traffic led by the domestic flight or the [ Ukraine flight or the Lufthansa ] flight, the oversea flight, Orly is the best airport.So in fact, we have to manage and to close or to open some terminal. But for the moment, we don't have, in our scenario, strategy to close Orly. Probably, we have to close 1 all in Orly. But when you see now the figures in term of traffic, last week, we have more passenger in Orly than in CDG. So we have to close probably a little bit in Orly, but probably more in CDG and we try to prepare this closing.So in terms of cash burn, your first question, so for the moment, we are very confident in terms of liquidity, as I say previously, we are -- obviously, we burn a part of cash. But we don't have a huge difficulty for the moment. And I can give you -- I cannot give you the figures because it depends on the month. Because we -- as you know, we have works with CapEx, but we burn part of cash. And we burn more cash at the end of the year than at the beginning. But in fact, we manage this situation. But sorry, I can't give you figures.
Maybe a follow-up on the testing. With the current capacities that you have, how many passengers a month would you be able to test during the winter flight schedule?
We don't disclose this information.
The next question is coming from the line of Cristian Nedelcu from UBS.
Three, if I may. First of all, could you give us a bit of color on the Q3 CapEx levels that you've spent? And equally so, when we look at the cash position, the net debt position at the end of the year, could you give us a rough range that you expect?Secondly, looking at the retail spend per pax, as you flagged in the past, in Q3, it has come down year-over-year. Could you give us a bit of color, how do you expect it to develop over Q4 and going forward?And then lastly, just looking at GMR, could you help us better understand the financial leverage at GMR for the next couple of years and the liquidity position they have there?
So thank you for your question. So first question, so to give you more color about our net debt, we expect -- we are now, at the end of September, with a debt net at a little bit close or higher than EUR 7 billion. So -- and we expect a slight increase for the end of this year, but not so much. The main part -- the main explanation for this is linked by the payment of the deal with Almaty Airport. But we don't expect a huge effect. And probably we reach EUR 7.5 billion at the end of this year.So we manage the situation. As you know, we have a specific guidance around net debt for the coming years and it's our priority. We try to convince all our stakeholders that our priority is to stabilize our net debt-to-EBITDA ratio.For the retail activities, as you know, for the moment, we try to manage the situation to concentrate all the high contributive passenger in a few number of terminal. So we try to manage the reopening or the closing sequence of infrastructure in relation to the traffic, but also in relation to the retail performance. It's a key strategy for us. It's the heart of our strategy because when you reach to convert to concentrate the high contributive passenger in few terminal, we can see a good effect in the sales per pax.In terms of -- also in terms of retail strategy, in terms of CapEx, we try to rebalancing of CapEx plan to be able to catch value for the next year, but we try also to adapt our operational structure to the new situation and to decrease strongly our operational -- OpEx.In term of sales per pax, you can see for the beginning of this year, the first 9 months, good performance with EUR 18.3 per pax. But when you see in detail our performance -- not EUR 18.3 but EUR 18.6. When you see in the detail our performance, we have a specific performance in Terminal 2E or K, that is the flagship of our terminal in term of retail activities. And for that, we have a strong performance, very strong performance, close to the performance of last year.Due to the strategy of concentration and due to the strategy to manage our OpEx level in our JV, especially in SDAR, but also in all our partners with the luxury brand. We try to develop a strategy step-by-step to have a good news for all our operators and to have good news to reinforce the model -- our luxury model. So thank you for this question.For the last question of GMR. As you know, we are very happy with this acquisition. And in -- when we announced this acquisition, we said clearly that we will have, during 5 years, not a good relative performance. But after in 2024, 2025 -- after 2024 and 2025, we can see in our business case very strong increase in terms of performance and with a huge relative effect in our accounts.In terms of liquidity and financial position for GMR, we can see that we worked with the GMR airport of the [ refi announcement ] for part of the position. But we don't expect a huge problem for the moment. But it's clear for us. It's the fact that now we have, in India, the new Deputy CEO that is appointed by ADP. And in the coming weeks, the new COO, we can start our industrial partnership and reinforce the global position of Groupe ADP and the position of the GMR Airports. So thank you for this question.
The next question is coming from Arthur Truslove from Crédit Suisse.
Three, if I can. So first one, just in terms of tariffs for 2021. I guess the first question around that is, what's your expectation for what they're going to be and linked to that, what's the process that you're expecting to happen prior to those tariffs being announced?Second question in terms of cash receipts in airlines, have you seen any change to the payment terms that you -- in terms of the cash that you actually received from airlines for the services that you provide?And thirdly, I was just interested in how you were getting on with the negotiations with your stakeholders in terms of delivering a potential long-term cost cutting plan? Obviously, you've increased your short-term cost cuts, but sort of wondering how much of that kind of EUR 650 million to EUR 700 million might be sustainable going forward?
So thank you for your questions. So first question about the tariff. So as you know, we don't have an economic regulation agreement for 2021. So we have a global and classical process with the consultation with all the airlines in a specific commission. So at one point, we have to request the approval of the independent supervisory authority, and probably to have an answer at the beginning of January or at the end of December.If we don't have -- the possibility to -- if the independent supervisory authority disagree with our proposal, we have the possibility to give a second proposal. And if it's not possible to apply the second proposition, at the end of the day, our tariff structure will be freezed. So at least we can freeze our charges. But we try to have a slight increase, and to manage this situation with all the airlines, we propose a slight decrease of 2.2% for the moment. But at the same time, we propose that is very, very huge effort of Philippe to stabilize our fees for -- after Brexit for all the U.K.So as you know, with the Brexit, the Brexit allows the possibility for ADP to increase strongly this fees, linked by the fact that we have the possibility to apply the international fees. We propose to stabilize the airport fees for U.K. to apply the current fees. But at the same moment, we propose a slight increase at 2.2%. That is less than if you compare with our loss of opportunity to increase the international fees for U.K. So that is for the tariff.In terms of the payment of airline. So for the moment, we don't have a huge problem with all the airlines to pay our fees. The large part of airlines pay in a good position. We are probably to increase our trade receivable depreciation but not linked by the airlines, but more than our subcontractors or the subcontractors of airlines. For the moment, we don't expect to use default by our customer in the aviation activities, for the moment.Your third question, it's about the cost control for the next few years in '21 and '22. So as you know, we are now in negotiation with all the unions to apply a specific agreement to decrease the number of people of ADP in a voluntary scheme, and to try to reduce the payroll of ADP in the short term.So it's a little bit early to speak about that. We are still in discussion. We are very happy to see that a large part of the company has a very responsible behavior. And we -- a large part of our cost control depends on the issue of this negotiation. If we fail to sign this agreement with the unions, it's possible to implement unilateral measure in terms of payroll, but also to launch a social plan with a constraint for all the people to ADP. So thank you for this question.
The next question is coming from the line of Marcin Wojtal from Bank of America.
So firstly, on dividend, when do you think the company should be able to restart dividend payments? Is it just a function of net profit and then a payout ratio or you would like to see the company first reducing leverage below a certain level?And number two, have you been giving any commercial discounts to airlines when it comes to aviation tariffs or perhaps do you consider giving any commercial discounts, perhaps, to incentivize traffic recovery on some specific routes? Would that be a sensible strategy in your opinion?And third question is more general. I mean do you see, as a result of this crisis over the next 3, 4 years, do you see a much increased presence of low-cost airlines in your assets in Paris, including Charles de Gaulle? And is that something that you think could accelerate the recovery, if you were to be more open towards low-cost airlines?
So thank you for your questions. In terms of dividends, so clearly, for this year, we don't have a net profit. So we don't have to expect a dividend in -- for 2020 paid in 2021. For the next year, when you speak with our shareholders, clearly, we have to manage our -- the level of leverage. And probably, we have to wait the reducing of leverage. But this reduction of leverage depends for a large part of our negotiation with your unions.So it's a little bit early to speak about dividend. We have to discuss with all our stakeholders, with the unions, with the employees, with the French state, with our minority shareholder to know if it's possible, if we can share all the efforts to fix a new dividend policy.In terms of commercial discount for airlines, clearly, we have to scope the regulatory scope and for -- in this regulatory scope, we try to manage the level of our fees, aeronautical fees. But we have also the commercial scope. And in this scope, in fact, we try to implement some marketing fees to develop the high contributive passenger figures and to develop also the volume in terms of traffic linked by the European flight.So in -- for your third question, probably the last summer if you asked this question, I'd answer clearly that we expect a strong increase in terms of low-cost carriers. Now when you see the situation in September and October, it's not easy for me to answer now. Probably in the long term, we have a recovery in term of low-cost carrier, better than for the legacy carrier. But it depends on the longer the crisis. I can give you more comfort. Probably, in fact, the share of low-cost carrier increases in the next year, but now it's not so evident.
We have 1 more question. [Operator Instructions] The next question is coming from Peter Hyde from Atlas Infrastructure.
I was just wondering if you have to spend any [indiscernible] in terms of your testing, and I was sort of wondering whether you could roll it out very quickly across all terminals at both CDG and Orly?
So clearly, we try to implement this test next Monday, end of October. But we are ready to do. After -- we are very confident to give result of test in 20 minutes after the test. And in terms of economic model, for the moment, we don't have a specific decision about that. It's a little bit early to discuss that. So thank you. Yes.
Next question is coming from the line of Ruxandra Haradau from Kepler Chevreux.In the meantime, the next question is coming from Dario Maglione from BNP Paribas.
Question for me. Three questions for me. One, on traffic, what do you expect for next year in terms of traffic for 2021?Second question, what cash OpEx amount do you expect during this winter?And third question on retail revenue per passenger, which was quite good in Q3 despite the lack of Chinese passengers. So I'm just wondering why you think that's the case? You mentioned the terminal -- concentrating flow in the terminal, but also do you have any fixed payments of rent within the rental division?
So thank you for your questions. For the traffic for the next year 2021, we are now -- we work now about our budget and our forecast for the next year. Clearly, our forecast will change in line with the current difficulties with the current decrease in terms of traffic in the end of September, at the beginning of October. So probably, we have a very low traffic in the first quarter of 2021.The main question is the level of recovery in April next year for the summer season. We have to discuss with all the airlines to have more color about the flight plan for the main part of our customer. It's difficult to know and it's difficult to modelize the sanitary measures, the effect of testing and the boarding -- the border authorization for a part of countries.So it's difficult for us. So clearly, we expect a recovery globally. But it's difficult to know if it's -- if we reach the half of the traffic of 2019 or the 60% or 70%. We have a hunch -- a huge hunch for the moment. So a little bit early to speak about that.In terms of -- for OpEx for the Q3, but also for the next period. So we -- for the Q3, it's not good -- it's probably not a significant quarter. Why? Because we have a huge partial activities, but also we have to convince our people to put vacation so when our people are in vacation, we have to pay all the people. And when we have partial activity, we pay just a part of the salary.So Q3, it's not significant. For the next year, it depends for a large part of our negotiation or for the unilateral measure if we don't reach to sign with all the unions.For the sale per pax, and the Chinese passenger and so on, it's sales per pax. So it depends on the sale, but it depends on the pax. And we try to adapt our infrastructure to put the good shops, the good goods. And at the good level, when you modelize week after week, the level of pax and the high contributive passenger.When you have a specific flight with China, we open some luxury brands, especially. And we have a good performance. That is very difficult for us. It's to manage this situation flight by flight to be ready to -- in terms of operational activity to catch value for all the different flights.So it's the reason why we are very, very focused to the concentration of the flow of passenger in very short number of terminal. But clearly, when you put the good infrastructure, the good passenger in the good commercial area, we have the same performance as last year or very close to the same performance in terms of sales per pax, not in terms of revenue. So thank you.
The next question is coming from the line of Nicolas Mora from Morgan Stanley.
Philippe, three, if I may. First one is on retail. Can you give us a little bit more color on basically what's working, what's not working? Because we saw quite a wide range of performance between ADA, between Relay, between other shops, food and beverage, it seems a little bit all over the place in the third quarter? That's the first question.Second one is, can you just clarify a bit what -- when you expect negotiation with the unions to potentially come to fruition? Is this something still due for this year?And last point, if you -- if we put together your OpEx and CapEx containment, where we might be at the end of the year in terms of net debt? I mean you know that we struggle to get to your 6x, 7x net debt-to-EBITDA projection for 2022. So can you help us understand why you stick to this guidance or to this projection when consensus is much lower? And when we all struggle to get to the implied EUR 8.5 billion to EUR 10 billion of net debt to be implied by consensus to hit that leverage. That should be it.
So thank you for your questions. So if I start by the final question about the debt net. So debt net and our ratio debt net with EBITDA. When you see your modelization and our modelization, we can see that we are globally in line with the EBITDA trajectory. But the main difference with large part of the modelization of analysts, it's linked by the level of debt net -- net debt.We are very cautious about the net debt level. So we put some buffer in these figures. So if we can reach better performance, we are very happy. But now we are very cautious. So globally, it's the main explanation of that. In fact, at the end of this year, we expect EUR 7.5 billion in terms of net debt. We try to manage not to increase a lot of these figures. But in our forecast, we put some buffer.In the second question about the unions issue and the agreement. In our agreement, we apply a large part of our cost-cutting plan at the beginning of January for all the measure. But if we have a voluntary scheme, the main part of the people good to the requirement -- retirement in April -- In April or May. And so we can add but it's a little bit earlier about that.A huge effect, a huge decrease in terms of OpEx in April. At the same moment, we have to establish our provision in -- for this year in 2020. When you have an agreement with the unions, we have a specific commitment to decrease the number of people, to decrease the payroll but at the same time, we have a commitment at ADP to try to manage the situation with this agreement without departure constraints plan. If we don't have this agreement -- so it's a commitment for 3 years.If we don't have this agreement, we can go directly to a social plan with unilateral measure. And we don't have a specific commitment during 3 years. So it's more manageable to adapt our situation. So when we try to have an agreement, the main commitment of ADP, it's just to say that we have one huge cost-cutting plan, but we don't have the possibility to have several cost-cutting plans. If we don't sign this huge agreement, we have the possibility to manage the situation and to put social plan after social plan.For the first question about retail. The good strategy is to open all -- or not all, but a large part of the shops in the same retail area. For example, we have a good performance with Louis Vuitton shops. If very close to Louis Vuitton, we have Chanel, Gucci and Hermès open. If we have just one shops, we don't have good environment to have good performance in terms of sales per tax.If we have to open perfume, we have also to open all the advertising stream because it's the main environment if we have a standard situation without a crisis like a bubble to be -- to give confidence to all the passenger to consume.So our main strategy, it's not to open 1 shop but not to over shop. It's to open all commercial area. And when you open all the commercial area, we have quite the same performance. Globally -- and globally for perfume, for alcohol, for bag or red wine, it's the same performance. So thank you for your question.So thank you very much. We are now ready to stop this conference. Thank you. Bye-bye. See you soon.
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