JinkoSolar Holding Co Ltd
NYSE:JKS
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JinkoSolar Holding Co Ltd
Earnings Call Analysis
Q2-2024 Analysis
JinkoSolar Holding Co Ltd
In the second quarter, JinkoSolar showcased impressive performance with module shipments increasing by 34.1% year-over-year to 23.8 gigawatts. This positioned them as the leading company in the solar industry, marking a cumulative total of 260 gigawatts shipped globally. This growth highlights the effectiveness of their globalization strategy—having operations spanning nearly 200 countries and regions. Approximately 60% of module shipments were directed to international markets, particularly with notable increases in shipments to Europe, which grew by 40%.
Despite achieving higher shipments, total revenue for the quarter was about $3.3 billion, reflecting a decline of 21% year-over-year. This drop was primarily attributed to a significant decrease in the average selling price (ASP) of solar modules, which fell by over 10% in comparison to the previous quarter. The gross margin was reported at 11.1%, down from 15.6% in the same period last year. Operating expenses also saw a rise of 24% sequentially, amounting to $525 million. Adjusted net income was $52.1 million, indicating slightly weaker profitability in a challenging market environment.
Looking ahead, JinkoSolar predicts that prices in the solar industry will stabilize at current low levels due to ongoing supply chain pressures and increased competition. The ASP decline is expected to moderate as the company shifts its focus away from less profitable segments, particularly in China. Management confirmed that module shipments for the third quarter are projected to fall between 23 to 25 gigawatts, while maintaining expectations for overall module shipments in 2024 to range between 100 and 110 gigawatts.
Despite the revenue decline, JinkoSolar remains committed to returning value to its shareholders, announcing a cash dividend of $1.5 per ADS. The firm has also repurchased approximately $130 million worth of shares as part of its ongoing share repurchase program. As of the second quarter, JinkoSolar maintained a robust cash reserve of $1.91 billion, although this was down from $2.4 billion the previous quarter. Their asset liability ratio improved slightly, indicating strengthened balance sheet management.
JinkoSolar is not only focusing on cost optimization but is also enhancing their technological capabilities. The company reported advancements in their N-type TOPCon technology with cell efficiencies reaching a new record of 33.24%. Additionally, the firm plans to increase its annual production capacity for solar cells and modules significantly, reinforcing its position in the market. A joint venture in Saudi Arabia represents a strategic move to localize production and leverage growth opportunities in emerging markets.
The global solar market is projected to maintain a robust demand trajectory, with expectations of around 600 gigawatts in 2024, particularly driven by growing installations in China, the U.S., and Europe. JinkoSolar's favorable positioning, backed by its extensive brand recognition and technology leadership, places it strategically to capitalize on these trends. The company anticipates that its continued focus on operational efficiency and larger market share will enhance its resilience against ongoing market disruptions.
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Hello, ladies and gentlemen, and thank you for standing by for JinkoSolar Holding Co., Ltd. Second Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. [Operator Instructions] As a reminder, today's conference call is being recorded.
I would now like to turn the meeting over to your host for today's call, Ms. Stella Wang, JinkoSolar's Investor Relations. Please proceed, Stella.
Thank you, operator. Thank you, everyone, for joining us today for JinkoSolar's Second Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference. The company's results were released earlier today and are available on the company's IR website at www.jinkosolar.com as well as on Newswire services. We have also provided a supplemental presentation for today's earnings call, which can also be found on the IR website. .
On the call today from Newswire are Mr. Lucinda, Chairman and CEO of JinkoSolar Holding Co. Limited. Mr. Gener Miao, CMO of JinkoSolar Company Limited, Mr. Pan Li, CFO of JinkoSolar Holding Company Limited; and Mr. Charlie Cao, CFO of JinkoSolar Company Limited. Mr. Li will discuss JinkoSolar's business operations and company highlights followed by Mr. Miao, who will talk about the sales and marketing. And then Mr. Pan Li, who will go through the financials.
They will all be available to answer your questions during the Q&A session that follows. Please note that today's discussion will contain forward-looking statements made under the safe harbor provisions of the U.S. Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. Forward-looking statements involve inherent risks and uncertainties. As such, our future results may be materially different from the views expressed today. Further information regarding this and other risks is included in JinkoSolar's public filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission. JinkoSolar does not assume any obligation to update any forward-looking statements except as required under the applicable law.
It's now my pleasure to introduce Mr. Li sender, Chairman and CEO of JinkoSolar Holdings, Mr. Li will speak in Mandarin, and I will translate his comments into English. Please go ahead, Mr. Li.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] We are pleased to announce that thanks to our leading position in N-type TOPCon technology competitive products as well as global sales and manufacturing network. Our module shipments grew by 34.1% year-over-year to 23.8 gigawatts in the second quarter, ranking first in the industry. By the end of the second quarter, we had led the industry as the first solar company in the world to reach a total module shipments of [ 260 ] gigawatts to nearly 200 countries and regions. .
This again demonstrated the power of our globalization strategy. In the second quarter, prices in several segments of the industry chain declined slightly on a sequential basis. we flexibly adjusted our production scheduling strategy and the utilization rates for different process and also optimize our supply chain strategy to control costs. Gross margin was 11.1% in the second quarter, almost flat sequentially. Adjusted net income was USD 52.1 million, slightly down sequentially.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] Global demand showed faster growth momentum in the first half of 2024. The newly added installations in China totaled [ 102 ]gigawatts in the first half, up 30% year-over-year. From January to June, total solar module exports increased by around 20% year-over-year. At the same time, we saw an increase in capacity expansion projects delayed, suspended with even some terminated as to 15 capacity, some manufacturers have cut or suspended production. Coming to the third quarter, prices in the industry chain were low and volatile with prices in most segments falling below cash cost. The utilization rates across the industry declined compared to the second quarter to an overall low level.
We view this irrationally low prices as sustainable Meanwhile, government and industry launched the control policies to promote the healthy and orderly development of the solar industry. financial institutions became more selective, preferring to favor strong and excellent companies with technological innovation and cost control capabilities as well as brand channel advantages. We believe that all these matters will further accelerate the elimination of the out digit capacities as well as industrial integration.
In the future, we expect the companies with robust sustainable operations to reinforce their industry leadership. The in-depth industrial adjustments are bringing challenges and opportunities to companies, we will continue to improve our management efficiency strengthen and expand our globalization advantage, taking on challenges in the industry with our resource advantages and innovative capabilities.
[Foreign Language]
Thanks to our global footprint and the competitiveness of our products, by the end of the second quarter, the visibility of our order book for 2024 exceeds [ 80% ]. We have maintained our overall leading utilization rates in the industry, especially for [indiscernible] sales utilization rate nearly the 100%.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] We kept a refreshing our record for cell efficiencies at the end of the second quarter, less efficiency of our N-type TOPCon-based perovskite tandem solar cell reached 33.24%, a significant leap beyond our previous record of 32.33% last year. The mass produced the efficiency of our 182 TOPCon sales excess 26.1%. We firmly believe that TOPCon remains in the past with the best economic performance in terms of cost, mass producing, production yield, intellectual property protection and customer acceptance and still has room for further cost reduction and efficiency increase. We intend to keep our leading position by gradually adopting new technologies, while consider both efficiency improvements and economic returns.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] we continue to optimize our supply chain to cater to the demands of global clients for low-carbon lean, high efficient and reliable products. In the first quarter of this year, we unveiled new green panels to produce the 0 carbon factory certified by TUV inland for compliance with the relevant criteria and the requirements. So far, we have received positive feedback from our clients. This once again confirmed our commitment to lean manufacturing and product innovation.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] [indiscernible] shift in international trade continuing expansion of our globalization capabilities is becoming increasingly important. As recently announced, we have entered into a strategic partnership with renewable energy localization company, a wholly owned subsidiary of PIS and Vision Industries Company to form a joint venture in Saudi Arabia for the production of 10 gigawatts of high-efficiency solar cells and solar modules. This is another step in our innovative transformation from global sales to global manufacturing and an important milestone for our globalization strategy. With years of experience overseas, we are dedicated to building localized solar ecosystem together with other partners to achieve synergy of resources and complementarity of advantages and further grow our competitiveness in the global market.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] We are accelerating the clearing out of P-type capacity to optimize our capacity structure. We expect our annual production capacity for mono wafers, solar cells and solar modules to reach 195 and 130 gigawatts, respectively, by the end of this year, we expect our advanced capacity structure to continue to lead the industry.
[Foreign Language]
[Interpreted] With other advantages in anti TOPCon technology, competitive products as well as global sales and manufacturing network, we reiterate our guidance for module shipments to be between 100 and 110 gigawatts for the full year 2024, and we will continue to implement our globalization strategy to actively seize market opportunities and mitigate market risks. We expect module shipments to be between 23 to 25 gigawatts for the third quarter of 2024.
By the end of this year, we expect net produced N-type cell efficiency to reach 26.5%. Overall, we are holding a healthy cash flow. We will continue to optimize the structure of our assets and liabilities as well as our cash flow levels, [indiscernible] our resistance to risks.
Thank you, Mr. Li. Total shipments were 25.3 gigawatts in the second quarter with margin shipment accounting for approximately 94%. We are pleased that we continue to example why in the world for the market shipments as we are increasingly recognized by global clients for our high efficient and reliable products and services. .
In terms of geographic mix, approximately 60% of our module shipment went to overseas market in the second quarter with Asia Pacific and Europe accounting for majority. Sequentially, shipments to the U.S. were relatively stable and shipment to Europe increased by 40%. Thanks to the continuous improvement in Tiger Neo product strength. Tiger Neo shipments accounted for 85% of total shipment in the second quarter a steady increase from nearly 80% in the first quarter as these modules are increasingly accepted by price, particularly in China, Europe and North America.
Currently, we lead the industry as the first solar company in the world to reach a cumulative anti-margin shipments of 100 megawatts. They continue to enjoy a premium in global market with premiums in some markets like Europe, U.S. and the Middle East, especially high. On the strength of our extensive global sales network, we will continue to optimize our shipments and the product portfolio. We were recognized as a top performer across all reliable categories, reliability categories in the PV module reliability or [indiscernible] consecutive time.
And we hope the PV tax 2024 Q2 module tax facility reported with the highest [indiscernible]. This is a continuous recognition of our commitment to quality, innovation and R&D over the long term as well as clients long-standing trust in our product quality, capability and reliability. Recently, we became one of the few companies to have on both Tier 1 energy storage provider and the Tier 1 PV module manufactured by Bloomberg. These orders are not only a testament to the power of our outstanding brand but also a formulation of our proactive contribution to global energy transformation. As the economic of solar energy become more apparent, we expect demand in the global market to stay around 600 gigawatts in 2024 and a growth [indiscernible] in 2025.
In addition to mainstream markets like China, U.S. and Europe, emerging markets such as Middle East and some countries in Asia Pacific are also showing strong growth potential. With our accumulated experience in global sales and a growing industry and footprint, we are confident we will over time, cease the opportunity brought about by the growth in global market demand more rapidly and more high efficiently and optimize overseas supply chain effectively cooperate changes in international trade policies.
We will continue to optimize our products and services on enhancing our competitiveness to overlay through strategic market positioning and outstanding client relationship meet.
With that, I will turn the call over to Pan.
Thank you, Gener. We are pleased to report sequential groups in motor shipments and total revenues in a very challenging second quarter. While module prices declined, we reduced cost through supply chain optimization and technology upgrade, improve operating efficiency of optimized assets and liability structure. Gross margin was relatively flat sequentially and our asset liability ratio was down by one percentage point compared to the year beginning. Despite the challenging situation in the industry, we did not stop returning value to our shareholders for their long-term support. .
At the beginning of August, we announced a cash dividend of $1.5 per ADS, which was paid today as planned. In addition, as of today, we have repurchased a total of $5.6 million ADS in an aggregate amount of over $130 million in the open market, an our share repurchase program announced in July 2022 and the extended share repurchase program announced in December last year.
Let me go into more details now. Total revenue was about $3.3 billion, up 4.4 percentage sequentially and down 21 percentage year-over-year. The year-over-year decrease was mainly due to a decrease in average selling price of solar modules. Gross margin was 11.1% compared with 11.9 percentage in the first quarter this year and 15.6 percentage in the second quarter last year.
The year-over-year decrease was mainly due to the decrease in average selling price of modules. Total operating expenses were about $525 million, up 24% sequentially and up about 18 percentage year-over-year. The sequential and year-over-year increases were mainly due to the write off the net book value of the equipment resulted from the [indiscernible] province, which was partially offset by estimated insurance proceeds from the 5 accident in the second quarter this year.
Total operating expenses accounted for about 16 percentage of the total revenues in the second quarter compared to 13 percentage in the first quarter and about 11 percentage in the second quarter last year. Net loss attributed to the JinkoSolar Holding Company Limited ordinary shareholders were 13.9 million in the second quarter this year. Excluding the impact of the change in fair value of the convertible senior notes, fair value loss related to the investment in solar supply chain companies. Share-based compensation expenses and net loss resulted from a fire accident in Shanxi. Adjusted net income attributed to the JinkoSolar Holding company, ordinary shareholders. was about $52 million.
Moving to the balance sheet. At the end of the second quarter, our cash and cash equivalents were $1.91 billion compared with $2.4 billion in the first quarter this year. AR turnover days were 89 days compared with 100 days in the first quarter this year. Inventory turnover days were 82 days compared with 89 days in the first quarter this year, as a result of improving operating efficiency.
At the end of the second quarter, total debt was a $3.6 billion compared to $3.66 billion in the first quarter. Net debt was $1.95 billion compared with $1.22 billion in the first quarter of this year. This concludes our prepared remarks. We are now happy to take your questions. Operator please proceed.
[Operator Instructions] Your first question comes from Philip Shen with Ross Capital Partners.
This is Matt Ingram on for Phil. Looking into the back half of the year in 2025, how do you see module pricing trending and then on gross margins, what is it going to take to return to the mid-teens margin levels? And do you think this could be achievable in '25.
Thanks for the question. This is Gener. I think in general, the market price will stay at, let's say, a relatively low level for a while for most of the market. It's really because in general, the oversupply situation is quite obvious across the industry. But for sure, the margin-wise, it depends on the cost. How fast the cost reduction can contract with low price situation right now, right?
So we at least from what we are seeing right now quarter by quarter or month by month, the cost reduction is happening almost every day. So hopefully, with the improvement from the cost control and also the all the actions we are taking on the whole industry is working on and the margin could go back to at least a healthy level as early as possible.
Okay. Great. And then kind of on supply and demand, with module prices so low for so long, is that resulting in any demand elasticity? And if so, which countries regions could we see upside surprise in demand? And then on the supply side, when do you think this oversupply situation across the supply chain gets resolved? Does this happen next few quarters, next 12 months or longer? .
It's really difficult to forecast, right, which takes the market will turn upside down. But we see everything to gradually go into that direction, everyone. From the demand side, no matter if U.S., Europe or China or other emerging markets. We still foresee a healthy growth year-over-year. Meanwhile, when we see the supply side, for sure, we have seen some newcomers has dropped their plant to give up what they planned to do previously. And also from the policy wise, we see some China government policy initiative, which is trying to control the new expansion of the capacity, which shows a pretty strong signal to [indiscernible] the capacity supply side as well.
So -- and also the current loss-making market will shake out some of the weak players across the industry to. So adding all those stuff together, supply side is we see a steady growth year-over-year. As the supply side, we see some actions taking. It might take some highs moving on the direction to to restrict the supply into more rational levels. So adding those 2 together, we hope to give it several quarters the things will get back to a rational level, I hope.
Your next question comes from Alan Laith Jefferies. .
Is Alan from Jefferies. So first of all, the result is actually quite impressive, especially during the backdrop of, right, very challenging market environment. So I've got a couple of questions or like agri management. First of all, what is the U.S. shipment amount? And also the U.S. shipment expectation in second half of this year? And what is your view on the policy risk in the U.S. market, especially the recently filings of critical circumstances. .
So for U.S., it's a very special market. We see the market is -- first for Jinko, we are gradually getting back our market share gradually after the efforts we have taken in the last 2 years' time. So if you look into the total shipment numbers, we have provided a range of 5% to 10% as the annual shipment range. But if we look into Q4, it's roughly 5% to 6%. So seasonally, a change is required. For example, right now, there's a rush before the tariffs kick in also as the market demand is picking up. So season-by-quarter, there will be some small changes. But in general, I think it's still fall into the range of between 5% to 10% of our [indiscernible] shipments in U.S.
And for the long term, we still believe U.S. is a great market. because of the demand [indiscernible] to the AI driven, the electricity demand is strong. And also the citrus to the new capacities, both on the manufacturing side and on the utility project development side as well. So in long term, we are still a big fan of U.S. solar market. And we will -- we believe we will continue to be there to find a let's say, a stable supply plan to serve our clients in the U.S., even there are some -- there might be some [indiscernible] on the trade policy side, but we still have some prepared solution on it.
Yes. For the second, I think we are talking about the circumstances for the [indiscernible]. No, it's really a little bit of risk, but we have proactively managed the situation and based on the renovations, and we think nobody we are the risk to Jinko.
Is it because of the relatively stable volume from Jinko, like there was no spike in volume. So you think it's actually compliant with the rules, right?
It's a little bit complicated, but where the [indiscernible] is funded to the case 3D, so if you are going to be qualified for the situations, mostly the volume shipments after the finding data case and the resist the fall and there should be a significant increase of shipments. So we proactively manage the volume. So that is one [indiscernible] iota. But there's still some kind of risk where we think the risk is low for Jinko.
So -- and also I would like to know what is the progress in our Middle East because there was a huge announcement on on the capacity tanking board in Saudi Arabia. So I would like to know what is the estimated time line of that capacity and what type of policy you expect would be benefited?
It's really a other strategic move for our international manufacturing and it's not only a purely facilities in San diagribia, and we are working with PIF and the racing industry is -- and the Saudi Arabia, we have a very big ambition for [indiscernible] by 2030, and we work together to localize production or advanced capacities to gigawatt so the module capacities. And some of the -- I think the government has at department, which is the goal is to help to promote local productions in Saudi Arabia. So we wait back after our operational in 2026 and the modules Saudi Arabia locally where we have, I think, have a premium compared to the modules out of the Saudi Arabia. And on top of that, the government has as strong support policies to the joint ventures in Saudi as well.
So would there be any localization requirement on tendering so that you can ensure all of the modules will be sold and also even some of your competitors will have to buy your modules because of that localization requirement.
I would like to be more confident that we will have a very unique competitiveness in Saudi and for the Saudi market. And the Saudi, if you look at the total market size, it's roughly 50%, 60% of the total Middle East and whether we are very optimistic in the next 3 to 5 years. And I think you want to expose you detailed policies. There are some policies existing, but it's going to be developed, I think, by the government as well. And the current policy is 20% local content with some kind of additional penalty. But the big issue is in Saudi Arabia, there is not any qualified module producers. So most of the developers at this stage, they get the waiver letter my understanding because there is no available local producers. But we -- I think we are in a good position to penetrate the market and after launch our joint venture.
So you'll be technically the only qualified producers by 2026. So that might bring you premium there, right?
I have not to say that, but I think we will be the first mover. So we take that round will be the .
And the accounting question on the financials because I saw in the adjusted calculations of adjusted earnings. Actually, it's around 380 million. So is it like [ RMB 665 ]and then you take 58% of shareholding on the loss of that -- so you saw that you get to $80 million.
So you're talking about EPS or we the average.
The adjusted net income, so it's shown as RMB 378 million. So there's a net loss due to the [indiscernible] exited of RMB 380 million. So I would like to know if this [ RMB 380 million ] is 58% of RMB 665 million in the A share level.
Yes, talking about the total number for the year is kind of the number you're talking about. And because 58%-- so 58%. So the minority -- there's, I think, a separate line, net income attributed to noncorroding interest that consolidate all the net income should be allocated to the minority interest from the perspective of the U.S. [indiscernible].
Understood. So including the loss from the Shanxi province, right? Is also proportionately. .
Yes, Yes.
Finally, my final question is what is the usage of FBR polysilicon now. Can you use 100% of that safe cost?
You mean the polysilicon out of China?
The [indiscernible] the granular polysilicon. .
Yes. Yes. We -- I think we get kind of improvement on the [indiscernible]. And typically, it's kind of 30% to 50%.
Your next question comes from William Grippin with UBS. .
Just a couple for me. The first one was on the tandem cell efficiency that you noted in the press release. Could you just talk about kind of where you are in the development process for that technology? And how long before you think we could see something become commercially available.
The trend is still in the early stage, but we are optimistic for the future [indiscernible] of the top content plus tend to take [indiscernible]. But still, it's -- if you look at the time scheme, it's -- we believe in the next 5 years, it's still in [indiscernible] space. And it's possible after 5 years, it could be commercialized, but it depends a lot of progress. So it's -- so back to impressing, we don't believe it's commercially 100% visibilities at this stage. And the earlier time maybe after 5 years.
Got it. And then just on the TOPCon side. Obviously, there's been a lot of headlines and reports of litigation companies claiming IP around TOPCon, a little bit hard to get a good handle on the patent landscape there. Just wondering if you could speak to how comfortable you are with your position sort of in the TOPCon IP landscape across your key markets? And maybe any sort of discussions around licensing or other legal actions that maybe you've been having?
So the patents we -- if we look at [indiscernible] kind of the TOPCon promoter, the leader of technology and in recent 3 years, we invested around 5% to 6% total revenue on R&D from a significant part we proven into the TOPCon. So we're really very confident about our patents, particularly on the top time. If you look at the total volume, look at the quality, if you look at pattern the spreads in different countries, particularly out of China.
So I think at the beginning of this year, we also announced some kind of news. We granted some kind of patents to one to solar company -- one solar module company as an [indiscernible] companies. So that demonstrates our strong capabilities on R&D and patent position.
Your next question comes from Rajiv Chaudhri with Sentara Capital.
I have a few questions. The first couple of questions are just housekeeping. Can you tell us what the depreciation and the capital spending numbers were for the second quarter? And what the targets are right now for the full year?
Okay. Thank you for the question. In the second quarter, we reduced our CapEx as compared with the first quarter, which was -- the total CapEx in the first half year was about RMB 4 billion. And our perspective total CapEx in the whole year will be adjusted to about RMB 9 billion.
Rajiv, I think the big question, the big picture -- it's a tough situation in the industry wise. But the industry has suffered in I think 3 or 4 quarters. And as a top one companies, we helpfully manage the companies and [indiscernible], and we balance the shipment for progress and further solidifying our positions on the cash flows, particularly. On top of that, we significantly cut the CapEx this year as well as next year as well as lower the operating expenses and optimize our operations and including the train some labor force. So -- and if you look at our CapEx next year, we don't have any CapEx except for the Saudi Arabia capacities, which is a strategic movement. So just for illustration for your understanding. But we think after several quarters, we cannot project active but we have seen the weak players, top to [indiscernible] 3, even some kind of relatively rental players have been consolidated or the phase out in June or the downward cycle. So we are getting -- I think we are getting prepared and ready to go through the cycle.
So are you suggesting that CapEx in 2025 will be even less than the $9 billion in 2024?
Yes. Definitely. And if you Saudi Arabia [indiscernible] very unique even because we take 40% equity and the real equity will be USD 100 million next year. So except for that, I think we have some kind of maintenance CapEx as well as some kind of investment on R&D CapEx. So definitely, it's going to be lower next year.
Okay. And what about depreciation in the second quarter?
So each month, roughly, if you want to use your financing models is kind of RMB 500 million lead to RMB 600 million you can put in a financing model. But anyway, if you have a detailed number questions, I would suggest that you can have a follow-up with opportunities and to give you a detailed one.
Okay. Okay. So moving on to the next question. That is on your average selling prices. your average selling price in the second quarter was down quite a bit. It was down actually more than 10%, 15% from the first quarter. And part of the reason I get from reading the presentation is that DG was 50% of sales. And most of DG is, I think, in China. So the combination of focus on China and DG led to more than a pretty sharp decline in ASPs. Now as we go into the second half of the year and shipments as a proportion of total just away from China shift away from DG will that provide a more benign backdrop for pricing for you.
The spot market price the last 3 or 6 months is continue to decline, but we think it's going to be the lowest level to be stabilized. If you look at financial numbers because they have different buckets in utility scale, the DD segment. We have different markets. U.S. in different regions and different lead times for signing a contract. So the -- if you look at the ASP, and you're right, I think it's affecting the industry, while down for spot market price with modules. But because we have differences in lead time, different countries. So in each quarter, in Q2, Q1, the average is in decide when we expect continued to trend third quarter is a stain the fourth quarter. So it's -- on the other side, if you look at the supply chain perspective, the material costs continue to trend.
So can we expect that the decline in ASPs will moderate in from Q2 to Q3 relative to what we saw in Q1 to Q2?
Yes, I would like to say if you look at Q4 versus Q3, it's going to be [indiscernible] moderate.
Okay. But can you say that we are at the point where pricing can be expected to be stable or we are not there yet?
I think kind of in time scheme, if you look at the sectors, most of the sector is suffering cash losses, we don't believe there is a significant room further. And with isocapacities, it should be kind of be stabilized. If you look at the sort of wafer price in recent weeks, some of top players, they have increase the swap market was a little bit and even [indiscernible] price has been stabilized. So the stability you will say the module and further solar sales in the price.
I see. Okay. Charlie, your costs were down apart from the decline in polysilicon prices, your production costs were down quite significantly also in the second quarter, and that helped you maintain the gross margin at a double-digit level. Can you break down some of the reasons why the costs were down? And can we expect cost to keep on coming down at the same rate that we saw from Q4 to Q1 and then Q1 to Q2, we have had some pretty dramatic declines in cost here, and that is separate from the polysilicon?.
Yes. There are a lot of efforts we are working on continue to to optimize some of the designs and the key materials, the purchase price in year to be have been improved -- improved working [indiscernible] and labor costs cut off and operating expenses optimization. So there are a lot of efforts we are working on.
So does that mean that gross margin can go up in the third quarter relative to the second quarter?
No, I don't believe that [indiscernible] taking better. I think we are confident the gross margin is fortune try to be able -- trying to stabilize.
But you're not confident that it can go up from Q2 to Q3 yet?
No. I would like to say stabilize kind of -- if you look at our peers, we are in relatively good positions and stabilize and based on it takes time. I think it's not going to take 1 or 2 years, but maybe take a couple of several quarters. And on top of that, we take leverage our global manufacturing and marketing creative and optimize the economics.
Okay. Another question is on the N-type market. What do you think the size of the N-type market will be in 2024 this year? I mean -- and what will your market share be -- if you do 90 to 95 gigawatts.
Sorry to interrupt you. We will take this as a final question. And for more questions, we can discuss after the call. Is that okay?
I think in time this year, it's kind of the top conduit. This is a dominating year for tiptop. And the market penetration for TOPCon, roughly, I'd say maybe 70% to 75% and Jinko roughly 90%. So that's look at look for next year, I think it should be [indiscernible] penetration for [indiscernible]. .
There are no further questions at this time. That does conclude our conference for today. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.