Welspun Enterprises Ltd
NSE:WELENT
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Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Welspun Enterprises Limited Q4 FY '24 Earnings Conference Call.
This conference call may contain forward-looking statements about the company, which are based on the beliefs, opinions and expectations of the company as on date of this call. These statements are not the guarantees of future performance and involve risks and uncertainties that are difficult to predict.
[Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Salil Bawa, Head of Group Investor Relations, Welspun World. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you very much, Sagar. Good afternoon to all of you. On behalf of Welspun Enterprises Limited, I welcome all of you to the company's Q4 and FY 2024 earnings call. Along with me today, I have here Mr. Sandeep Garg, Managing Director of Welspun Enterprises Limited; Mr. Saurin Patel, Managing Director of Welspun Michigan Engineers Limited; Mr. Lalit Jain, Chief Financial Officer for Welspun Enterprises; Siddharth Bharadwaj, Head IR Welspun Enterprises.
We hope you have had a chance to review the investor presentation that we filed with the exchanges. The presentation is also available on the company's website. During today's discussion, we may be making references to this presentation. Please do take a moment to review the safe harbor statement in our presentation. As usual, we will start the forum with opening remarks by our leadership team, and then we'll open the floor for your questions.
Once the call gets over, should you have any further queries that remain unanswered post the earnings call, kindly feel free to reach out to any one of us. With that, I would now like to hand over the floor to Mr. Sandeep Garg, Managing Director of Welspun Enterprises Limited. Over to you.
Thank you, and good afternoon, everyone. Welcome to the Welspun Enterprises Q4 and FY '24 Results Conference Call. I would like to thank all participants for their presence. We have uploaded our results on the exchanges and our website and I hope you have had a chance to review the same. We start FY '25 with the highest ever stand-alone opening order book of INR 12,200 crores. This order book includes close to INR 3,600 crores of operation and maintenance. This is a clear reflection of WEL's diversification strategy and our meticulous approach to order selection.
The water vertical now has a share of close to 67% in the order mix with the balance being in the transportation vertical if you are to consider only the EPC order book. Post our results, we have emerged L1 in one of the MSRDC road projects, where our quoted price is INR 1,864 crores approximately, the details of which have been afforded on stock exchange. We would inform you further details of the project once the LOA is issued by the client.
Our subsidiary Welspun Michigan Engineers Limited, has an opening order book of INR 1,600 crores. This makes our consolidated order book of formidable rupees INR 13,800 crores, which is about 4x our consolidated revenue for the FY '24, although it is not material from the listed entity point of view, but I would like to mention that Welspun Michigan has also emerged L1 for an order worth INR 170 crores, the details of which will be shared by Mr. Saurin Patel, Managing Director of WMEL in his address.
I'm certain you will appreciate the immense visibility such as order book provides. We are certainly [indiscernible and we are working to further build on our project pipeline. Our future ordering within the transportation vertical, we have seen a continued muted period in the last quarter. Having said this, we see promising growth opportunities from NHAI and in the state of Maharashtra in the next few quarters.
I would like to reiterate that we at Welspun are extremely positive on opportunities that lay ahead of us. We believe the country's CapEx spend will double over the next 5 years from a base of approximately INR 11 lakh crores. Our balance sheet strength positions us extremely well to seize on this opportunity and thus deliver many years of profitable growth.
At Welspun, we strive to achieve excellence in every sphere of activities that we take on. In this direction, we are pleased to share that Welspun Enterprises has been recognized and certified as a great place to work by GPTW Certification Agency. Welspun also saw one of the highest employee participation among the corporates, which was at 96% during the certification. I'm also extremely pleased to share that trust index of 88% of Welspun Enterprise employees have rated us as a great place to work.
Our [ ranking ] will be announced on June 20, which we will share with you in our next engagement. While we have grown sequentially on a quarterly basis, our revenue in FY '24 has dropped on year-on-year basis by 8%. Our stand-alone FY revenue is INR 2,450 crores, while total income is INR 2,560 crores. Though we expected to do a bit better on revenue, however, holds on workfront on our SNRP and BRP projects and continued challenge on our ESR construction and UPJJM project led to deferment of revenues to FY '25.
I want to assure you all that our teams across the transportation and water verticals are continuously solving these issues on real-time basis. I would also like to mention that in FY '24, we achieved EBITDA of INR 439 crores on a stand-alone basis, which is the highest stand-alone EBITDA for our company in any financial year. On consolidated basis, our revenue has grown to INR 2,872 crores with total income of INR 3,063 crores. This marks the highest consolidated revenue in the history of our company.
Similarly, our consolidated EBITDA of INR [ 6,016 crores ] for FY '24 is the highest in the history of the company. I stand corrected, INR 616 crores in FY '24 is highest in the history of the company. I would like to emphasize that the model we follow for development projects has life cycle of 5 years. This includes the period of project construction, stabilization and monetization.
Considering this life cycle, we have delivered an average [indiscernible] percentage of over 12% in the past 5 years. The accounting classification notwithstanding this percentage is a reflection of business potential and the model that we follow. The details of the financials will be covered by CFO, Mr. Lalit Jain, in his address.
I'm also pleased to inform that the Board has recommended dividend of 30% on face value, that is INR 3 per share for approval by the shareholders. I want to mention that excluding the current recommendation of the Board, we have distributed over INR 700 crores by way of dividends and buybacks, which translates to a return of about INR 50 per share.
Now coming on some operational highlights on major projects for the concluded quarter. Our HAM project, Aunta-Simaria has gathered pace in execution and we anticipate this to continue as we target the completion. The bridge work is more or less completed by more than 90%. The balance roles are primarily road and approach, which we target to complete by Q3 FY '25. Our HAM road project of Sattanathapuram-Nagapattinam, SNRP is progressing but I must share that this -- the pace is slower than our plans. We have interacted with client on both nonavailability of Pond Ash and earth materials and delays in approval of mines by earth for earth extraction. We remain confident to deliver the project on targeted time lines.
Our EPC work of Varanasi [ ArandabasNH2 ] is progressing well, and we are on track to meet our completion target date. It is an honor to share that our section of the National Highway was selected to be inaugurated by the Honorable par minister, which is a testimony to the quality of execution that we deliver for our clients.
Coming on our water vertical, our UPJJM project in the state of UP and in the state Water and Sanitation Commission is progressing well and despite challenges of multi-location and distributed work, this project has crossed a significant milestone of 50% of targeted household connections. Skilled manpower shortage, especially for DSR has affected pace of progress. We are deploying various strategies to overcome this shortage, including the [indiscernible] option and also steel, which we have proposed to the plant.
Paradi wastewater treatment facility, our project to deliver the clean met River has progressed well. After a period of rain earlier quarters, we have moved ahead with the improved execution. We have planned our execution in [indiscernible] to minimize the impact of the impeding monsoon months. We are adding another significant orders in the last quarter, and I'm pleased to inform that the design build and operate BBO for the development of the new 2,000 MLB water treatment plant at [indiscernible] Complex, including civil mechanical and electrical instrumentation work has been awarded to the company. The project is designed -- sorry, the project is to be designed and constructed within a period of 48 months from the notice of the proceed, which is still awaited and thereafter operated for a period of 19 years -- 15 years, sorry.
The total contract value excluding GST is INR 4,123 crores. The split of which is that the design build is INR 2,243 crores while [indiscernible] is INR 1,880 crores. During the quarter, we continued with our efforts for development of oil and gas field, blocks housed in the joint venture, Adani Welspun Exploration Limited. We submitted our EDP to the regulator for our block MDOS in 20052 or what we call Mumbai block in this quarter.
Subject to the approval of EBP by government, our endeavor is to commence gas production by FY '26, '27. We have are the contract for well designed and engineering and also finalize the feed contractor. We have the approval to invest INR 100 crores into this venture in the current financial year. I would like to reiterate that in line with our prudent approach, we will comment -- we will commit future capital only upon clear visibility of commercial viability.
As I conclude, I'm delighted to share that Welspun Enterprises was restored with 2 national accolades at the 15th CIBC Vishwakarma Awards, construction HFC award and artisan and supervision award for UPJGM, Mission and our EPC work at Varanasi Aurangabad road project.
With this, I now hand over the call to Mr. Saurin Patel, MD of WME.
Thank you, Sandeep, and good afternoon, everyone. I'm happy to share that we have clocked the highest quarterly revenue in Q4 FY '24 at INR 141 crores. Our revenue for full FY '24 is INR 411.8 crores. This marks a growth of approximately 30%. Having completed the process of integration with Welspun Enterprises, I'm extremely optimistic of increasing our growth momentum in FY '25 and beyond.
This performance has been consistent from a margin perspective wherein we have achieved an EBITDA margin of 23% for the full year, which translates to a whopping INR 99 crores. Both our current projects as well as potential new wins gives me immense confidence of sustaining these margin levels. We have currently 18 projects, which are spread across micron segment tunneling, marine works, pumping stations, rehabilitation of underground sewer lines and bridge construction. These combined projects give us an outstanding order book of approximately INR 1,627 crores, with INR 170 crores of operations and maintenance.
This order book is largely executable over the next 36 months. I must add here that I'm not including an order of INR 170 crores from the MCGM to rehabilitate underground [ sewers ] using glass reinforced polymer liners, whereas Michigan has been declared L1. I would like to reiterate that we foresee vastly larger opportunities ahead. These opportunities are both from new geographies due to Welspun world's wide reach as well as new initiatives that we are evaluating such as working with new technologies.
We have been an engineering solution provider for urban and infrastructure needs, which is a niche area, and we wish to operate in the specialized niche areas of tunneling and water rehabilitation projects on a larger scale. Historically, we have been a very profitable company and our EBITDA growth over the last 3 years has been a CAGR of 33%.
I would now like to share a brief on an exciting new technology partnership that we will be introducing to India. [ SmartOps ] is a cutting-edge technology to convert gray water into an asset. It is modular, scalable, cost-efficient and easy to deploy technology in a water body or drain point to rejuvenate or recycle the water, river, sewers, ponds and lakes. This involves biological treatment of wastewater with minimum basis and provides tertiary treated water portable water for commercial and domestic use.
Besides SmartOps, we at Welspun Michigan Engineers, a pioneering hyper-tunnel, which will replace or substitute in part the existing methods of bot-pushing for road under bridges and the widely used NATL method for hand mine tunneling. A unique combination of proven technologies using artificial intelligence, 3D printing and swarm robotics, from diverse industries to build a tunnel and enhance any underground scheme. This is a new approach, a radically new approach, which is safer and more sustainable than current techniques and it is claimed to be 5x faster than the current rate. Our order pipeline is healthy and with the rollout of the new technologies for the future that I mentioned earlier, we retain our sights on projects worth INR 20,000 crores. We will be bidding for these on a selected basis. With this, I will close my remarks and hand the call to Lalit Jain, CFO Welspun Enterprises Limited for updates on the financials. Over to you, Lalit.
Thank you, Mr. [ Saurin ], and good afternoon to everyone, and many thanks for being part of this call. I'm sure you would have had an opportunity to review our financial numbers published. Our [indiscernible] FY '24 total income is INR 2,553 crores and INR 285 crores for FY '24. I'm happy to inform that we have delivered the highest reported EBITDA of INR 439 crores, which were out a margin of 17.3%. For quarter 4 FY '24, our revenue from operations stood at INR 644 crores and other income or total income was at INR 5,665 crores. We reported an EBITDA of INR 97 crores, which was out to a margin of 14.5%.
Our profit before tax for Q4 FY '24 is INR 87 crores, which was out to 90% conversion of our EBITDA to PBT. This is predominantly because of our unique business model. This gives us the ability to retain a very large part of our EBITDA. I am confident we will continue to scale our operations while being [indiscernible] the successful model.
You may recall that we have given a guidance of reported EBITDA margins in the range of 13% to 14%, we will [indiscernible]. Our income has dropped by 64%. Our other income has dropped by 64% to INR 22 crores from INR 60 crores in Q4 FY '23. This is due to the high west from Q4 FY '23 where we had the large part of our proceeds from the assets sale to Actis on our balance sheet. Likewise, our finance growth has dropped 67% year-over-year to INR 8 crores in this quarter since we retired NTV that were outstanding in Q4 FY '23.
I do not anticipate an increase [indiscernible] from these levels in the near future. Our effective tax rate will be 25% in the normal course. But for this quarter, it is close to 28% due to additional tax provisions taken from [indiscernible]. Our stand-alone profit after tax will be INR 64 crores. Please note this is not comparable with Q4 FY '23 numbers. There was an asset sell transaction we undertook with Actis highway in December 2022, which resulted in additional income of INR 37 crores.
Now coming to our consoled numbers, Our concept FY '24 total income is INR 3,060 crores and PAT is INR 319 crores for FY '24. I'm happy to inform that we have delivered the highest consolidated reported EBITDA of INR 616 crores, which worked out to be a margin of 20.1%. For Q4 FY '24, our revenue from operations stood at INR 821 crores. And along with other income, our total income was at [ INR 5,367 crores ].
We reported an EBITDA to INR 157 crores, which worked out to a margin of 18.1%. Our PBT INR 120 crores and PAT stands at INR 78 crores. I would like to mention that due to consolidation of Michigan Engineers as a subsidiary, the contribution of Michigan Engineers towards EBITDA is INR 31 crores. However, 49.9% of Michigan's PAT has been reversed due to minority interest. We have a strong balance sheet with the net debt of this INR 93 crores as on 31st March 2024 at stand-alone level. The reduction of INR 625 crores as compared to 31st March 2023 is on account of buyback worth [ INR 289 crores ] payout for NPL acquisition of INR 137 crores followed by the equity investment of INR 156 crores in ongoing projects and the remaining amounts used for the working capital. Now I transfer this call to Mr. Garg.
Thank you, Lalit. Before we open the forum for question and answers, I would like to correct myself. Apparently, while talking about the new wins for which we have been declared L1, I said the name of the client, [ Ramly ], and I would want to correct myself to say that post our results, we have emerged L1 in one of the MSRDC road projects, that is in Maharashtra where over quoted prices at approximately INR 1,864 crores. I would request to bring this correction on record.
With this, I will request that the floor be opened for question and answers. Over to you.
[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Siddarth Singh from Green Portfolio.
Am I audible?
Yes, you are.
So my first question is, as the semiconductor industry is witnessing a growing demand for the ultra pure water. So does our company have a technology to build infrastructure for that or how we are seeing that opportunity?
Can you repeat the question, please?
Sir, I'm saying that in semiconductor industry, there is a need of ultrapure water, okay? As we are into the water infrastructure segment, so do we have -- do we are targeting that technology also? Or what are our take on that ultrapure water.
So let me respond to this question by saying that we are not into technology per se ourselves of development, okay? We use the existing technologies to deliver projects. In terms of the technology associations that we enjoy at this point in time, we enjoy a relationship with [ Xylem ], which is one of the largest water treatment and product supplier. We also enjoy our relationship with [ Veolia ], which is the largest water treatment technology suppliers.
So technology is something which we have an access to anything that should we require for a particular project. Michigan on its own Welspun Michigan on its part, is associated with new technologies and new ways of achieving desired results, but that technology is not targeting ultrapure water. So I hope I've answered the question.
And sir, sir, can you give the detail of current bid pipeline, how much order we bid for in water and transport and vertical and also the historical conversion rate?
Normally, in the water, our conversion rate is extremely high because we have bidded very selectively. Now talking about the opportunity on water business, there is a huge opportunity, as we all know. The short-term opportunity of pipeline that we see at the top of the [indiscernible] is about INR 1 lakh crores in the areas that we are interested in. So this is a short term, which means that we expect these to fructify in FY '25.
As we speak at this point in time, there are no open bids on water. There is an open bid on our transportation section, but there are no open bids on the water segment.
The next question is from the line of Dhananjay Bagrodia from [indiscernible] .
Congratulations on good set of numbers. I wanted to ask you, you mentioned that there's a INR 3 lakh crores project for water available which out of that, how much would be addressable to us and over what segments? Are you seeing this INR 3 lakh crores.
Approximately see, that's a larger canvas, which is a short-term and a medium-term water segment. The segments that we have targeted are primarily distributed in 3 hedge. That is the transmission, treatment and distribution. So treatment per se includes the water and sewerage or wastewater treatment, desalination and river rejuvenation. So in treatment, we cover 3 aspects, while transmission includes the pipeline and the river linking works.
So if I were to look at the total canvas, we see opportunities in the Maharashtra of about INR 1,25,000 crores, in the Madhya Pradesh about more than INR 50,000 crores, in Uttar Pradesh approximately INR 17,000 crores, and the list goes on.
So in this INR 3,00,000 crores, how much would be risible to us, as say, would it be only the lag of treatment because the pipes would come in comps, right? So that won't come in the transmission part will come to us. So on the treatment part will be to us, right?
No. So when I'm talking about these are the project values, which we can do, which we can target in terms of construction contracts, now EPC basis. Now with -- the pipes have to be bought from our company, whether it is Welspun Cop or any other company that will be a supply for the company which wins it rather than anything to us. So it's not excluded there.
Okay. And in terms of -- so regarding this right now in the water opportunity, which is coming back to the same thing, so INR 3,00,000 crores. Is there any idea in terms of like when this could be executed by how would it go? And how are we seeing in this [ Jal Jeevan ] on their official website, they are above 80% in terms of their targeted households. Is that something which you think we are ending the cycle? How are we looking at that?
Sorry, could you repeat the last part of your question.
So on the official Jal Jeevan Mission on their website, they say that a significant portion of the water of [indiscernible], which they wanted to reach are done. But there's not been -- nothing has been explained on how much is now for the river linking. So how do we see that segment grow? Because I believe the TAP the last leg has been done in most of the households.
So household connections, then government is pretty much focused on delivering it. And the official website, I haven't browsed it, so I will take it on face value and that is what we have done. But as far as the orders that we have, we have across the household connections of more than 50% on 31st of March, and the pace at which is growing, I'm sure we would be somewhere close to 65%, 70% at this point in time.
However, the government is in terms of water interlinking -- river interlinking, the projects are just about to take off. They will be bidded going forward after the elections are over. That's what our anticipation is. So with this -- that work will start unfolding from FY '25 and go for a few years going forward.
Okay. Okay. And so -- okay, so -- okay, fine. So for us, now since we are not in the last leg of distribution, since we are in transmission treatment. For us, the opportunities will be much bigger going ahead vis-a-vis some of the PVC players who are in the distribution part. Is that the right way to answer this?
So I think we -- I would want to correct that we are already in distribution. If you look at it, we -- the vast water project is distributing water to the industries in MP. And in UPJJM, we are already doing distribution to the villages about 1,070 schemes, about 2,500 villages. So we are already in distribution. So it's not arena, which is outside our capability to deliver projects.
Okay, fantastic. And lastly, in the order book, we have around -- roughly around INR 14,000 crores. How do we see that executable over time? And how should we look at those numbers?
So as we look at it at this time, I would want to say that the FY '25 looks healthy. We anticipate from the orders that we already have in hand, somewhere around INR 3,000-plus crores of revenue should mature on a stand-alone basis for the Welspun Enterprises. And the orders that are in the offering, we expect that we will be able to add another about INR 300 crores to this number. And in terms of the consolidated level, we do believe that we will be somewhere around INR 4,000 crores on a consolidated basis.
Okay. So it's fair enough to assume that 1/3 of the order book is executed over every year, more or less.
Yes.
Fantastic. And lastly, coming around, are we looking at any CapEx numbers for the year? How should one look at that?
The CapEx number, as I -- we pre-committed CapEx at this point in time into the business is approximately for the HAM projects is approximately about INR 200 crores and about INR 100 crores towards the oil and gas. The balance cash flow -- balance cash reserve is available for any further growth of the business.
The next question is from the line of Sri Krishna Agrawal from Agrawal Consultancy.
Hello. Am I audible sir?
Yes.
Just wanted to know, sir, you have the existing order book of around INR 15,661 crores, including your subsidiary. So your normal time limit is 3 years for completion of the project. So can we assume that the annual turnover will be decreasing to INR 5,000 crores per year.
As I just said that we would give you -- that we expect the turnover for FY '25 on a consolidated basis to be around INR 4,000 crores.
The next question is from the line of Nirav Shah from GC Holdings.
So firstly, I mean, from our press release, we've mentioned that we have 5 road project bids where the results are awaited. But I believe this would be the yesterday and does it include the recent order win where we are not [indiscernible].
Yes. So the -- out of the 5 open bids at that point in time when we went to the press release, 4 have opened. And 1 of them, we have opened EMERGE L1. There's 1 bid which is still not open, which is at NHAI. So we are awaiting that result whenever it opens.
Perfect. That's the first question. Sir, second question, I mean, we've mentioned we've derived -- you mentioned the Michigan top line at around INR 141 crores for the quarter, what is the corresponding EBITDA impact for the quarter from Michigan?
Give us a second, we will give you the number. The corresponding EBITDA is INR 99 crores for the full year. Just give us a second. We look at the number. For the quarter, Michigan EBITDA is INR 32 crores.
Got it. Fair point. And last quarter, we gave a guidance of INR 500 crores for Michigan, but if I just derive the consol minus stand-alone standard, you've given a guidance of INR 3,000 crores on existing book plus another INR 200 crores to INR 300 crores on the new wins. So our Michigan guidance would be approximately INR 600 crores to INR 700 crores for the current year?
That is correct. It's really about INR 600-plus crores.
INR 600-plus crores. Perfect. And another last question is, sir, from when will we start the execution of [indiscernible] project?
As I stated in my opening statement, we are awaiting the notice to proceed. I think post the election process is complete, we should be noticed to proceed. And thereafter, we will start the work. If it is very close to the monsoon period, we will not hit the ground. We will hit the ground post the monsoon period.
Post the monsoon period. Perfect. And on Michigan, just lastly, the INR 600 crore top line would be at stable margins of existing 23%, 24%. Am I correct in assuming that?
That is correct.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of [indiscernible] from Crown Capital.
Congratulations on a great set of results. I hope I am audible.
Yes, you are.
Yes. Sir, a lot of my questions have already been answered. I just wanted to just [indiscernible] a bit in terms of the margin side. So on a consolidated basis, our margins stand at 15%, right? Because INR 600 crores will be at a higher end than our normal 14% margin in the stand-alone. So is that a fair assumption, sir?
For Michigan you are talking.
No, on a consol blended basis.
If I get you correctly, the question is what is our guidance on the margin for the FY '25 on a consolidated basis.
Yes, yes sir.
Okay. So our guidance would remain at the level. Sorry, we don't have a guidance on a consolidated basis on margins. We -- as the CFO has mentioned, we will retain our guidance on margins going forward at 13% to 14% on a reporting basis on stand-alone. On a consolidated basis, as Michigan evolves, we will maybe look forward to giving guidance on the same in the near future.
Okay. Fair enough, sir. And just wanted to ask with regards to currently out of election or something. So is there kind of order book be impacted with the change in regime or how do we just see that risk in terms of how we are going forward?
So the order book that we have in -- under our belt remains unchanged for sure, irrespective of any governmental regime change. And I believe that the forecast also remains unchanged because no matter which government comes in, I think the impetus on development of infrastructure [indiscernible].
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Sri Harsha, KJ, who is an Individual Investor.
Congratulations on a good set of numbers. The EBITDA margin is reported of 20.1% for financial year '24. Is it like is it sustainable going forward? Or will it remain at 13% to 14%.
As we have always maintained, our guidance is 13% to 14% on the EBITDA. This term, I mean, is an abrasion to that normal, but we will try to improve, but that's our guidance for you to consider.
Another question, sir, regarding the order prospects of the big pipeline. You told on the water projects, it's around INR 3,00,000 crores. And the order prospect for the transport sector and then for the other subsidiary from Michigan.
So the order pipeline as far as the NHAI has announced that they will be awarding about INR 5,200 crores of projects on [ toll ]. We see an order -- [ expensive ] order being announced in the FY '25. It could be somewhere in the range of about INR 2 lakh crores that are likely to come through in the coming months or coming quarters. And as was stated by MD Welspun Michigan that their order pipeline is to the extent of about INR 20,000 crores. However, in terms of what we believe that will fructify, I think the order wins for us on a stand-alone basis, maybe somewhere in the ranges of INR 6,000 crores and about INR 700-odd crores for Michigan. So that's what we would believe that we would be happy guiding about.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Sarvesh Gupta from Maximal Capital.
Congratulations on a good set of numbers. Sir, just one clarification, the 13% to 14% guidance for EBITDA margin is excluding other income or including other income?
It is at the reported EBITDA level, which includes the other income.
Okay. And secondly, on the oil and gas side, as I understand, so there is a INR 100 crores sort of an investment that we are planning in this year. And in FY '25, '26, you have said revenue from the first block to be expected but I also heard something on FY '27. So is it FY '26 that we expect the revenues to flow in?
No, we don't expect the oil and gas revenues to flow in FY '26. If there is any past information that you are referring to, I would guide that at the earliest that we can expect the revenues is '26, '27 that too subject to the approval of the ETP, which we have submitted to the government. So we don't know how much time it will take to approve. Once it is approved, we will give you a better guidance on that.
And on the earlier question, I want to clarify that the guidance of 13%, 14% of the reported EBITDA level is for the stand-alone, and not for consolidated.
Yes. So it is reported EBITDA, including other income for stand-alone?
That is correct.
The next question is from the line of Shayam Garg from [ Ladder UP ] Finance Limited.
I just wanted to know the details about the working capital cycle, which has an increase [indiscernible] it will come out in the coming years.
Can you repeat the question, please?
I just wanted to know about the working capital cycle for the coming years. FY '24 we see an increase in working capital days? And how is it going to go in the future?
We do not expect any increase in the working capital days going forward. We will be in the same ballpark numbers going forward as well.
Okay. And so is there any payments which are due from the government in terms of arbitration?
Sorry -- can you repeat, losing you?
Are there any payments from the government, which are due and are under arbitration?
We have no arbitration at this point in time with any of our clients.
The next question is from the line of Diwakar Rana from Prudent Equity.
Sir, my question is basically, you are giving INR 4,000 crores revenue guidance for FY '25. So if I remember correctly last con call, you said that we will be doing INR 3,000 crores this year basically in FY '24. And the revenue growth for FY '25 will be 15% to 20%, but right now, you are saying that the revenue will be INR 4,000 crores. So it is kind of a 39% growth in FY '25. So I was asking basically so what made you change the guidance from 25% to 39% for FY '25?
So there are 2 reasons of change. Number one, there is a fair visibility of orders that we have in hand. And since they are starting at the year -- start of the financial year, it helped us forecast a bit better. And the INR 4,000 crores which you are referring to is on a consolidated basis. The guidance for the stand-alone remains at a level of INR 3,000 crores from the orders in hand and INR 300 crores upside on it by the orders that we anticipate to get. So the guidance is anything between INR 3,000 crores and INR 3,300 crores.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Saket Kapoor from Kapoor & Company.
My question pertain to our Jal Jeevan Mission in the state of the Uttar Pradesh. Sir, hearing you have alluded to the fact that there were some issues pertaining to execution, which I missed in your opening remarks, [indiscernible].
Thank you. Sure, we will clarify. See the project involves construction of ESRs or what we call elevated storage [indiscernible] these are -- I just know the tanks that you see around in a lot of places. The number of tanks to be built is substantially high and that much of skill set manpower is not available at this point in time. So to do it in a conventional method, that is one area where we were lagging. So we have opted for doing it at a precast solution so as to expedite the project. And we have also made a suggestion for steel tanks, which is going to expedite it further. So we expect the project to over construction difficulties in the FY '25 as we move along.
So this was the only reason that led to lower exit [indiscernible].
In the UPJ [indiscernible]. So as I said, there were certain poles on the major projects which we are undertaking right now, which is the VRP and SNRP where because of certain client holds and the local holds, work fronts, we got stuck, which we have got released to a large extent now. So that resulted in loss of some revenue, which got transferred to FY '25 from FY '24.
Sir, when we look at the size of this opportunity, since Uttar Pradesh in itself is equivalent to having population equivalent to other countries in the world, so can you allude to the size of this [UPJJM] mission, I think for other -- and also the other players who are keenly awarded these packages and what's the total size? And going ahead, what is -- what are the other opportunities post the execution which you are anticipating after [indiscernible] does it involve other scope of -- and total, how many players are working over this project [Foreign Language].
So you've asked a lot of questions in one question. I'll try and answer to the best of my ability. So currently, if I get it, if my information is right, UP alone has about 70,000 villages currently being connected through the UPJJM mission. So now this mission will not get completed with this. We still will have a lot of states like Rajhastan is coming up, MP is coming up. So there are a lot many states, which will have, a lot many villages still to be connected.
UPJJM in UP alone has 4 phases. We have participated in Phase 2 of the project. So I think in terms of the continuation of the opportunity, this will continue for my suggestion for next 3, 4 years. But the larger opportunity in water will unlock once these connections are made because the reuse of water will become important, the recycle of water will begin once the water is available. And then that see the opportunity as far as water is concerned for the next 20 years, to be there around all these water tread-water supply, processing of used water and reuse of the water and making the nonrevenue water into effect as well as making the wastewater [indiscernible], this life cycle for the country, I see for at least the next 20 years.
Okay. So the stopes just to dwell further and conclude the scope of work for Welspun would be greater than there is the supply of water, which is what the understanding.
That is correct.
And sir, on the number of players who are involved in this project, could you name a few of them other than we have also heard [indiscernible] speaking about the Jal Jeevan Mission for Uttar Pradesh valued at INR 16,000 crores. Then there's one other player, [indiscernible] they are spending INR 6,000 crores. So just to take the size and the key players, if you could [indiscernible] a few names.
People involved includes right from the top of the line [indiscernible] to grow to smaller players who have taken about 400, 500 villages. So the spectrum is pretty large. I would think at this point in time, UPJJM-related projects, there are about at least 20 entities, if not more involved. Top of the scale will be the likes of LNP and the LCC and the bottom of the scale would be people which are new and trend like [indiscernible], et cetera, et cetera. So we where they have taken small steps towards this opportunity. So the spectrum is pretty large, but the opportunity is much larger. That's what I think.
And if you gather the momentum for this financial year, this is what your understanding is.
What I am saying is UPJJM subsurface schemes, surface schemes, linking schemes, all is a very large opportunity, but the larger opportunity after this forward is once the water has been used, what do we do about it. So that's the larger opportunity that shall[indiscernible].
Right. And for this year, INR 2,900 crore target [indiscernible].
Sorry?
For this financial year, we will be executing INR 2,900 crore worth of the project under this.
The INR 2,600 crores, INR 2,700 crores is my total UPJJM project in -- for this distribution, out of which I think we have delivered about 50% -- 50%, I think majority will be delivered in FY '25. Some of it may spill onto FY '26 as well.
Okay. sir, then the INR 2,900 value which you provide in your presentation Page # 38, 39, that alludes to which part of the story?
Can you -- can you just bear with us as we open that slide, can somebody open up slide, please.
38 and 39, please.
So just to clarify the presentation, what -- it is the scope of the project, which is about INR 2,900 crores in totality, part of which 50% is executed at this point in time across [indiscernible].
Am I clear?
Sir, I am just making these 2 numbers, 2,544 and 2,900. So if you could tell what was the size of the order awarded to us? How much has been executed last year or current year [indiscernible].
So INR 2,900 crores is the awarded contract value and the number of villages that we are connecting is 2,544.
And how much have we executed for FY '24 [Foreign Language]?
Up to FY '24, we have executed approximately 50% and the balance, a majority will be done in FY '25. Some of the work will spill onto FY '26 as well.
Sir, on the oil and gas front, I missed the initial part, I just go through it if I had some followup, I will contact the investor relations. I missed your opening remarks.
There are no further questions. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Sandeep Garg for closing comments.
I want to thank all the participants for joining us on this call today, and I hope we have been able to address all your queries. We remain committed to creating value for our stakeholders and our focus is on delivering improved return on equity and return on capital employed.
I look forward to speaking to you once again in the near future. Meanwhile, please feel free to reach out to our Investor Relations team, Sidharth, Salil or our IR agency for any questions or feedback. Thank you, and good day.
Thank you. On behalf of Welspun Enterprises Limited that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. You may now disconnect your lines.