Prestige Estates Projects Ltd
NSE:PRESTIGE
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Prestige Estates Projects Ltd
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Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Q4 FY '22 and FY '22 Earnings Conference Call of Prestige Estates Projects Limited, hosted by Axis Capital Limited. [Operator Instructions]. Please note that this conference is being recorded.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Samar Sarda from Axis Capital. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Margaret. Once again, welcome to you all. As always, we have the senior management from Prestige Estates Projects. I welcome Mr. Irfan Razack, Chairman; Venkata Narayana, CEO; Amit, the CFO; and Mr. Sarma. I congratulate the Prestige team for a great FY '22 and also good luck for the recent set of launches in [ Bombay ] from May 17.
Mr. Razack, over to you for your initial comments.
Thank you, Samar. As usual, our team has been batting hard and actually trying to create value to the company as well as to the stakeholders. And I think the highlight of '22 was the sales itself, operationally, and the collection, both crossing INR 10,000 crores and also INR 7,500 crores, both are a record high. It's just not showing sales and not getting collections, but the collections also have been very, very good. And then rest of the components, all asset classes have started doing well, including the Hospitality, which was in sort of a gray area or in a stress mode for the last 2 years. It really, really picked up and is booming now. And also retail malls. Of course, most of our malls are now with Blackstone. We hold only 15% stake in all these malls whatever our share was. I'm happy to say even the Blackstone transaction has been concluded.
And during this financial year, we also completed a stake sale to CPPIB, one of our office blocks. So all in all, we are in a very comfortable position in terms of liquidity and also doing a lot of work. And like you mentioned, Samar, on the Bombay launch, we had a good event on the 17th of May in Mumbai, and this has led to a lot of demand. We still haven't even started officially publicizing, but the sales have been extremely good. Response has been fantastic. And I think that will show in the results in the June quarter.
So with this, I'll hand over to Venkat to add whatever else he wants to add, and then we can take the questions.
Thank you, sir. To get into a little bit of details on the projects. This quarter, as Chairman said, has been a fantastic quarter, both in terms of Q4 sales as well as year as a whole.
The Q4 total new sales were at INR 3,268 crores, up by 77% year-on-year, sold 4.85 million square foot of area overall. The collection for the Q4 were INR 2,461 crores, and we launched 5 million square foot of projects, commercial as well as residential. And we completed during the quarter, almost 5 million square foot of projects.
So year as a whole, if you look at operationally, total INR 10,382 crores of sales, up 90% year-on-year, and we sold overall INR 15 million square feet of area. And collections are at almost INR 7,500 crores, up by 47% compared to the previous year. We launched all in all geographies that we operate in, 16.77 million square foot of projects during FY '22. And we completed 14.26 million square foot of projects in all.
And the contributors catalyst for the sale have been primarily the city that we launched at Sarjapur Road in Bangalore and the projects that we launched in Hyderabad.
So these 2 led the momentum for the sales. Of course, all other projects also have contributed.
In terms of financial parameters. Again, it's been a good year. Year as a whole, if you look at, we have total top line of INR 6,600 crores, EBITDA of INR 1,744 crores; and PAT of INR 1,214 crores. So EBITDA margins are at 26%, and the PAT margins are at 18.41%.
For this quarter, the top contributor for the revenue recognition has been Prestige High Fields in Hyderabad, which got completed and had a revenue contribution of over INR 1,000 crores.
As Chairman said in the opening remarks, we have completed Blackstone Phase 2 transaction, but there was some money that was linked to [ CF ] in terms of demerger. Even that got done, that's during this quarter, and we have a balance [indiscernible] money of INR 250 crores, which should come in the next couple of weeks. So with that, the transaction is fully complete, whatever we have envisaged to be done in 2 phases, as informed earlier.
And we will -- in addition to whatever we have launched, we will have other launches coming up in Mumbai, which we'll update you as we go by maybe at the end of next quarter. So far, whatever we have launched, the momentum has been good, that gives us the confidence to take up the launch whatever else is in the design and planning stage. And we're happy to say that with the expansion to the Mumbai region and the NCR region, where we will have a launch maybe next quarter, even the contribution from those geographies will come in. We hope to consolidate at this level and in fact, try and grow from the presales number that we have achieved for this year.
Now overall spend in terms of construction this quarter has been INR 1,200 crores, INR 850 crores towards residential and INR 140 crores towards office, and INR 210 crores towards retail, CapEx and hospitality. And year, as a whole, we have spent INR 4,373 crores on construction this year, almost INR 3,000 crores on residential; INR [ 650 ] crores on commercial; and around INR 270 crores on retail; and INR 500 crores roughly on hospitality. So that's been the spend. The spend on hospitality is a little higher because last year, we had the completion of JW Marriott at Golfshire, which is doing extremely well. And that got opened on March 5. So there was spend, substantial spend towards that property during the year.
So these are the spend numbers and given operation and financial snapshot. With this brief, I would request Samar to open the forum for question and answers.
[Operator Instructions]. The first question is from the line of Atul Tiwari from Citigroup.
Sir, just a couple of questions. So normally, your presentation has a pretty detailed guidance for the next year. So for FY '23, what would be the key guidance numbers in terms of total sales, your share, et cetera?
From last year to this year, if you look at we've registered 90% growth. The primary focus and objective this year would be to consolidate and ensure that we registered sales upwards of INR 10,000 crores. We would have more or less clarity on the launches that we can do this year because last year sales of INR 10,000 crores has come on the backdrop of [ 16 ] million square foot plus launches. So launches are the key. We don't have too much of inventory in our hand right now. All put together at this momentum, what we have is 3 quarter inventory. So therefore, launches become key. We will be able to spell it out to you in detail maybe the next quarter along with the results as to what sales guidance we can give since it's going to be linked to our launches, and we want to take stock of all approvals [indiscernible] upwards of INR 10,000 crores is what we have in mind.
Okay, sir. And sir, the second question is on the debt figure. So just trying to kind of get some more understanding. So your consolidated net is about INR 34 billion. But if I add the debt across different segments that you have disclosed, obviously the number is INR 56 billion. So is it a difference between gross and net? And does it mean that across different businesses, we have about INR 20-odd billion of cash?
No. This is both. So there is a gross number, and there is a number that comes for consolidation and net number. This is a combination of all 3 because the debt that we have borrowed in some of the SPVs, where there's other partners who are holding equal stake, we account as a joint venture company, therefore, that doesn't come for consolidation. And whatever has come for consolidation, minus the cash that we hold is the net debt.
Okay, sir. So how much is the cash number on use -- arriving at the net consolidated debt?
No. So specifically to answer that question that you're talking about is whatever the number that you have looked at minus cash, INR 2,200 crores that we hold, cognitive.
Okay. And sir, lastly, very quickly, I mean, will it be possible to share the balance CapEx for under construction office, retail and hospitality projects?
Yes, you can. Give me a moment. No that [indiscernible].
Yes. Just office, retail and Hospitality, sir?
Yes. Yes. So office, retail and hospitality, all put together, balance to spend, our share is INR 2,317 crores.
INR 2,317 crores. And any rough breakup, I mean, half of it will be on office or how to kind of break?
INR 1,600 crores is on office, INR 170 crores is on retail, and INR 540 crores roughly is on hospitality.
Sir. Sorry, sir, how much on hospitality?
INR 540 crores.
INR 540 crores, yes.
The next question is from the line of Pritesh Sheth from Motilal Oswal.
Congrats on great year for the company as a whole. My first question is on your debt number going ahead in, let's say, FY '23, how much you envisage to spend on the CapEx and land development, I mean, land acquisitions that we have done this year? What is the outflow that you are expecting for this year? And how should we look at the net debt trajectory this year?
We've always guided for the net debt of 0.5%, even in the previous quarter when we were having interactions with you. We said our endeavor is to ensure that we stay around that number and will be guided accordingly. We just mentioned about the CapEx balance to spend INR 2,300-odd crores on commercial, retail and hospitality.
Yes. The other point that you've raised is what is that we are going to spend. We need to spend on [indiscernible]. That number, I think, would go up because of the scale at which our operations are happening. Earlier at INR 5,000 crores of presales, we need to have x amount of raw material to launch the project. Now if we are to sustain INR 10,000 crores of top line and grow on that, the raw material that we need to have so that sales will be slightly higher. So therefore, we need to get up to the next level. Having said that, we still endeavor to work towards and endeavor to keep our debt equity around 0.5.
Okay. And any update on the fund that you were looking to raise to fund your residential land acquisitions? Any update you can provide on that?
Yes. So on that front, we had made a significant improvement. We have identified [ LPs ] and the investors who are going to participate. That leg has been frozen. Now it's about some modalities that we need to complete as to how much can be invested in each project and the governance mechanism and regulatory-related stuff. Hopefully, that should be done during this quarter and next time when we have interactions that should be live and operational.
Okay. And lastly, on -- you also, I think you are also doing the [ Shivshahi ] Re-Development Project in Mumbai. Any details on the launch, on the investments that we do make because what we know is that re-development has been stuck because of some issues with the [indiscernible] developer. So any update on that?
Did you mention [ Shivshahi ]?
Yes, yes. [ Shivshahi ].
Okay. So the discussions are on right now. There are many loose ends. It's not just about developer. It's about bank-related issues. It's about existing customer issues. It's about our plan and the allocation of units to them. And all these aspects, they are bringing to state. Step by step, we are resolving. And hopefully, by 30th June, everything should get concluded, and we should be able to find [ definitive ] documents.
Okay. So launch should be like '24 or even later than that? What...
No, launch should be, if all goes well, this fiscal. Maybe by December '22.
The next question is from the line of Kunal Lakhan from CLSA.
My first question was on -- if you can give some color on the Mumbai residential launches, how they have done so far? And I had a particular question on Jasdan Classic. The West Tower there seems to be -- seems to have been sold out. So just any color on these projects individually, if you can share?
Irfan here. I am really happy to stay after the launch that we had on the 17. The momentum has been really good. The channel partners and our team has worked hard, including our publicity, still hasn't yet started, maybe we'll start this week, but the response has been tremendous. We have a target set for ourselves till June end, and I think we will exceed that target, especially in TPCM Mumbai. And then the other one, you talked about Jasdan. It's only a question of releasing which units, when. Construction, of course, is going on at a good pace. So we want to bring it to some critical mass and get the interest, and I'm very, very sure we'll get some good numbers from there. Already the sales have picked up. It's not that West Tower is fully sold, that's not the story. But work is going on. And I think the sales team have a certain strategy how to handle that.
[Technical Difficulty] Did you hear me, Kunal? Hello? Hello?
We lost his line, sir. So we will move to the next question. The next question is from the line of Biplab Debbarma from Antique Stockbroking.
Sir, first question is on the FY '22. Congratulations on the great set of numbers. Sir, just wanting to know what are the top 3 projects in terms of sales booking and how much they contributed in FY '22?
FY '22, what contributed the maximum was TPCM Bangalore, the Prestige City, Bangalore, that's at Sarjapur, and that has done amazing numbers. It continues to do good numbers, and it's got scale. It's a very large development, almost 160-odd acres and quite substantial inventory. But we were -- we thought that we'll sell this inventory over the next 5, 7 years, but it just seems to have flown off the shelf. So that's a good news. Apart from that, we have projects in Hyderabad and also other projects, which we launched in Bangalore, like the Primrose Hills, all have contributed well.
And going forward, we have like Venkat rightly said, we need to beef up and get some more launches. Of course, Bombay has been launched now. Bombay, this fiscal, will have a lot more launches. We've -- apart from what 3 we have launched now, we've also got the Ocean Tower, which will happen in August, September. So that's how it is. And I believe all these will give us also good numbers.
Sir, my question was because I know that Prestige City at Sarjapur had a great response. So just wondering whether we can replicate that kind of because that's a unique project we got from what we heard from you as well as from the [ channel tech ] that it had a unique response and robust response. So in FY '23 -- because was one project contributing so much, so in FY '23, that's why the question was asked, whether we can replicate similar kind in other projects or...
Yes. Yes, we can and we will because Prestige City is continuing to be sold, as I said, in this fiscal. Plus, now we've got TPCM that is Mulund, Mumbai. And that is also now started, fancy and is selling very well. And like I said, now we're going to get sales from Mumbai. We have got a project, which is fully ready, to be launched in Noida, where there's a lot of interest. We're just waiting for the approval. The moment that approval comes, it gets launched, it will -- see it happening. And now in Hyderabad, we've got some large developments, some large land we've tied up, even the planning and process is on, and let the approvals come, we are going to start.
Apart from that, in Bengaluru itself, we can't afford to ignore Bengaluru, there are some 3, 4 very large development that we've tied up, which are planning has happened. It's all in approval process. And even those will happen in this fiscal itself, like we've got Lavender Fields, we've got Serenity Shores as well as Park Grove. These are large developments, and these also will give us numbers. So there is a certain thought process strategy. And the whole idea is that we should and we must cross the current fiscal whatever we've gone by numbers. And we can't fly backwards. We're only going to looking at things going higher, not lower. And we're confident we'll cross it.
Okay. My second question is on the status of BKC 1 and 2. So where are they? And sir, what would be the outflow in terms of cost incurred, plus loans and advances? Total outflow? [indiscernible] in each of these project, BKC 1 and 2?
A good question. It's BKC 1, 2 and Liberty Towers, that's in Mahalaxmi, all 3 are office projects, totaling to almost 6 million square feet. All approvals are in place now. All premiums have been paid. In BKC 1, there's 1 [ CRZ ] approval that is awaited and the meeting is fixed for June 6. That's just about 2 weeks away from now -- a week away from now. Once that gets done, I believe that we are on good track. These projects, already filing has started, work has started in all these 3. The structuring is still happening. We are working out the structuring, working on the methodology. And also, we are trying to see how we can have more reliance on equity than debt.
So it's a work in progress. I can't spell out everything just now. Once something gets done, we'll let you know. But mostly, these projects also, Venkat and the whole management, the whole idea is how to see that we use more equity than debt for these projects and see that they are produced quickly. And I'm very confident because of location and the design, these will get consumed faster. There is a lot of interest in both these projects.
Sir, did you say that BKC 1 project approval not received, but what started?
No, no, approval -- all approvals are received. I mean I can't start work without approval. Only there's one portion where I need to get that [ CRZ ], which will come in the month of June. So with that, we are fully through. And I've got the approval to start filing, so we started to file. All premiums also have been paid.
Okay, sir. So you have received all the approvals and what you've started in BKC 1 and [indiscernible], right, sir?
Yes.
The next question is from the line of Girish Choudhary from Spark Capital Advisers.
So firstly, if I look at your upcoming project list, if you can provide some more clarity on the Noida project, which is 3-point -- around 3 million square feet and Prestige Highline, Chennai, which is 4.5, and also the Park Grove, that's in Bangalore, which is 9 million square feet. Because outside of Mumbai, these projects appear to be large. So any clarity on approval, launches, micro market will be helpful.
Actually, Noida, our marketing suite, our show units are all fully ready. It's a bride, ready to get married. It's just because of the elections, the approvals got delayed. Hopefully, we should get the approvals in the next 60 days. The moment the approvals are in place and the RERA number is in place, there's a good inquiry, like I said, this is for Bougainvillea in Noida. Then the other one is you talked about Highline in Chennai. Yes, even that there was 1 or 2 regulatory issues, which we have sorted out fully now. The plans have been redrawn to meet those regulatory issues. And hopefully, the approvals also should fall in place in the next 2 months.
With that Highline is a large development in Chennai, and we don't have any other residential project of that size in Chennai, and I believe that also will give us good numbers only in this fiscal because this will definitely launch this fiscal [Foreign Language]. And then we've got Park Grove, even that is also work in progress. It's again a function of approval.
So Park Grove, is it more FY '24 launch or...
It will be this fiscal only. All the -- including Lavender Fields, which is again a large one. So all this will be this fiscal. We need to now really put effort and put in a lot of pressure to see that we get the approvals quickly. There is demand, and we need to see that we are able to satiate the demand and not miss it.
Got it. Secondly, if you can just give some outlook on your Hyderabad pipeline, in terms of both the launches and then also the incremental business development.
Hyderabad, we've also got this Neopolis land, which we bought, the company bought that, and that the plans have been drawn and the land also has been registered to the company. And now the approval process is on. Even that, hopefully, we should be able to get the approval this quarter, but then the launch will happen only in the next quarter. And apart from that, we've tied up a large tract of land, almost 70 acres, and that also we are going to again name it either the Prestige Falcon City or the Prestige City in Hyderabad. That's a large tract, which will have a high-rise apartments. There's going to be 1 million square feet retail mall as well as villas, and that, I believe, will be a huge number mover. Even that could be the third quarter of the year because it's a large project, we need to spend a lot of time on the design. Design process is 50% through. And once it's done, and land has already tied up, regulatory issues have to be sorted out. And I believe we should be good to launch in the last quarter of this year.
Got it, sir, and all the very best for FY '22.
The next question is from the line of Kunal Lakhan from CLSA.
So I think like a couple of weeks ago was an article stating that you plan to invest about INR 4,500 crores in Mumbai. And it also said that you spent about INR 3,000 crores already -- sorry, you have spent already spent about INR 4,500 crores and you plan to spend INR 3,000 crores or so. If you can just give a breakup of this INR 4,500 crores that you spent in Mumbai?
It's on [ around there ], INR 3,000 crores, spent 4,500. And I'll give you a breakout. It's the amount that we have invested from loans, the payment that we have made for BKC. And there has been classic now it's 100% owned by the amount that we have incurred towards that. And BKC 1 and the 2 projects there, and Prestige [ in particular ] [indiscernible] paid, and Marine Lines project where we paid [ a close ] INR 300 crores of money. And Jijamata Nagar what we have incurred. So combination of all of these.
Okay, that's INR 4,500 crores.
No. I said what we have incurred overall to be INR 7,500 crores. What we will incur is around INR 3,000 crores. INR 4,500 crores is what we have incurred.
Okay. And you mentioned that the balance CapEx is INR 2,370 crores, which is Prestige's share. This includes these projects, or?
See, in this, Kunal, I just summarized the entire Mumbai for you [indiscernible] perspective. Right now, we have 3 residential projects, that is Prestige [indiscernible] and Prestige [indiscernible]. These are the 3 residential projects. All 3 have been launched. Now we have got to see the commercial project, which are 2 of BKC and one at Mahalaxmi, which is [indiscernible].
In addition to these 6 projects, we have 3 in pipeline that is -- when we receive portion or at Marine Lines, Prestige -- we have not named a project at [ Shipshine ], which earlier I mentioned in the call. And projects [indiscernible].
So except for [ Shipshine ], an account of everything, there's been outflow. So I gave you a summary of outflows we have incurred.
So as far as 3 commercial projects is concerned, it's also [indiscernible] CapEx projects outflow.
So the INR 1,600 crores of balance CapEx for office that you shared, does that include BKC 101, 2 and Liberty Towers?
Yes, it does.
In your share? In your share of CapEx? Okay.
Sorry?
Your share of CapEx including that INR 1,600 crores for these projects?
Yes.
The next question is from the line of Adhidev Chattopadhyay from ICICI Securities.
So first, my question is on this construction cost. Since some of our projects which we launched last year, we have sold a substantial portion of that. Considering the rise in construction costs and how it impacts you in terms of the ongoing projects and further new and upcoming launches, how are we looking at pricing? And if you could also quantify what is the price hikes you have taken across the portfolio in the last 12 months. That is the first question.
Our budget, unless they are nearing completion, because there could be price there -- there could be price fluctuations. We did toward some contingencies in the budget. So therefore, is not redone. As you notice the prices, the prices have started coming down. And yes, we have inventory in both. The prices of inventory have gone up a little. The price rise in the construction materials have been factored in, in the new launches in terms of increased pricing. So therefore, we believe that we should be able to maintain the margins that we had in mind at the time of launch of the project.
And if the price rises were to continue, maybe when we come closer to the completion of the project, we'll see there is going to be any impact.
[indiscernible]
Increasing the cost of the pricing of the inventory that we are holding and also the prices of the new launches.
Quantification in terms of rising prices and rising costs, any percentage you could share at the portfolio level?
What happened is price did go up for just about a couple of months. Now again, they cooled off. Government has taken some good measures. Steel price again has dropped, cement has dropped. And I believe that it will be 7%, 8% overall, if you look at the life cycle of a project. But whenever we do our budgeting and pricing, we always factor the 7%, 8% increase because we are also on a cognizance of the fact that prices will never be stagnant. So when we do our selling price as well as our budgeting, this is already factored in. Only if there's some extraordinary rise like that happened for a couple of months, that we have to take that into our side. And what we have done is suitably corrected our selling prices also. So I think net-net, there won't be any big hit on the bottom line.
Only impact that you may have to look at it would be because there is no like inventory realization of your cost in the CapEx projects. That, we'll consider.
Yes, yes. Sir, just to clarify on the Slide 22, when you give the ongoing projects commercial. Sir, sorry, on the next Slide 23. So is it that our 2 BKC projects and the Mahalaxmi project commercial, the area is almost 10 million square feet, the TDA. So how do we -- what is the conversion factor we should use to calculate the leasable area, these projects? Either for this project?
The [indiscernible].
Sir, the question is for the gross to the -- from this developable to leasable, what is the conversion factor we should be using across projects?
60% would be the number, 60% to 70% would be the number.
The number we should use, right, to arrive at 60% to 70%?
Yes. 60% to 70%.
The next question is from the line of Sameer Baisiwala from Morgan Stanley.
My first question is on fiscal '23 outlook. Just if you can give us a response of what could be the collections versus what could be the construction spend.
So fiscal '23 outlook, very positive and optimistic, and Chairman was answering the earlier question you mentioned, the [ 2 PP ] at Bangalore has been a catalyst in our INR 7,000 crore to INR 10,000 crore benchmark. And the Prestige City as a concept now will be taken to other cities where we are doing the larger developments.
So therefore, we saw the launch of the Prestige City at [indiscernible]. We'll have some one-of-a-kind township coming after in Hyderabad. And we have a large project, not named like that, but it's a sizable in Chennai as well. So though we have had a 90% growth compared to the previous year this fiscal, FY '22 outlook is that we want to work towards bettering those numbers. Approvals are underway for many of the large developments. So we'll work towards that and outlook is promising [indiscernible] presented.
Now the second question, the spend on the construction and business development. Conceptually based on the ongoing projects that we have done, but the business development updates have to look at. Now we need to have our land bank that is capable of giving these kind of presale numbers. So we may have to invest a little more on that front. We need to have that pipeline. If you look at our entire inventory, premium actually completed or ongoing, everything together is around INR 7,000 crores. That is now at the scale of operations, this 3 quarter inventory. So we are strategizing a plan now, because now we are done with our first set of launches in Mumbai, what should be the plan for Mumbai region? We're also looking at something in Pune now. And also [ NPI ], we have one project that's about to get run subject to approvals, and we need to have that strategy for [ NCL ] region as well.
On the business development front that we outlay, but as we said earlier, the way we are looking at doing a business development now to flow fund and make that fund by the land and give for the development. So that the outlay will be minimal from Prestige Estates' point of view to embark on these developments and the scale.
Yes. But are you sharing any numbers or rough estimates on the inflow versus outflow?
Inflow versus outflow for the next fiscal? Or generally, business development working in the outflow?
Just for fiscal '23?
Fiscal '22, that is all I can give you. For fiscal '22 on business development front, it's been a high amount that we have spent. Land, the DDR and state buybacks and refundable deposits all together, we have had outflows [ around INR 4,000 crores ]. We may have to spend between INR 2,500 crores to INR 3,000 crores at least towards the new business development this year. Now whether this amount will be spent by Prestige Estates or it will be spent by the fund that we are floating and the fund will do for the development for Prestige, that clarity, we will be able to give you once the fund is up and operational. Maybe the next quarter introduction that we are doing, we'll have a lot more clarity.
Okay. That's great. And likewise, for construction like you did INR 4,300 crores in fiscal '22. How do you see the run rate for fiscal '23?
Similar numbers. It will be slightly higher, INR 5,000 crores is that construction. A lot of projects are getting completed. And the newly launched projects will not have as much spend in the first year of operations. The construction spend is not evenly distributed between 3 years. The majority of what happens in the last year of construction because a lot of material being [ bottled ].
Okay. And you had somewhere around collections of INR 7,500 crores for fiscal '22 Where do you see this number in fiscal '23?
I think we will have construction. Also, there will be improvement because what are the presales that we have made from ongoing projects that installments will kick in. Under new projects, the initial booking amount of installments also will start coming in. I think collection should be in the range of INR 7,500 crores to INR 8,500 crores.
Okay. Okay. Great. Very clear. And just on the gross debt maintenance, that's on your Slide #9, where you give segment-wise debt buildup. So from Q3 to Q4, the number has moved from INR 4,100 crores to INR 5,600 crores. So just in 1 quarter, it's gone up by roughly INR 1,500 crores. So just, I mean what -- I mean at the project level, what really is driving this big change?
[indiscernible]? Can you just Slide #9, you are talking about?
Yes, Slide 9. If you add up all the components, commercial received, all of them, it was [ over ] INR 5,600 crores. And in Q3, it was INR 4,100 crores. So just in [ 1 crore ], the gross debt has moved up by INR 1,500 crores.
This will be some of the payments that we have made towards the acquisition of projects for exceptional INR 300-plus crores of money went to pay Marine Lines. But some of this money that we have drawn, we're also sitting as cash. So the growth has gone up, but the money is lying with us. So that's why net remains [ INR 2,000 crores ] of money [indiscernible].
Okay. But you will be making this -- this is a project level drawdown, so you will be making these payments. So the cash can probably come down in a quarter or so?
Yes, it will come down in the quarter or so, and maybe new projects will get added because including ongoing CapEx, whatever we have, and new residential -- sorry, new office projects also will get added.
Okay. Okay. That's fine, Venkat. One final question is, sir, just a broader macro question. People are worried about interest rate up cycle. So how do you see this impact on your business? This home business, office business or if the rates start to move up 100, 200 basis points as we go forward.
100 basis points is slightly higher. If you were to go up by a little more, maybe equal in to whatever it has increased that much has been impact, 100, 200 basis points increase will definitely affect the sentiment of the homebuyer.
But if you were to take 1 more or maybe 2 more at [ long-term 50 ] basis points each, that is something I think should not effect. In fact, historically, if you look at it, there is inflation and the inflation making interest rate hike. The best [indiscernible] inflation turned out to be buying the investing in real estate. And there is a lot of traction even from the homebuyer point of view. And they also have the fact that the home loans are taken for 10 years, 15 years. Even if they have started out taken at a lower interest rate, the increase rate will be applicable even for those guys. It will get averaged out during this elongated period. They are aware of that. It's mostly about starting at a lower level. Maybe the lower eligibility to some extent, because of higher interest rate at the beginning, might slightly get reduced. So we don't see that to be impacting so much because the needs on buying the home and the COVID period, in fact, reiterated the necessity for having a home of their own.
So we don't see much. But as far as the office and other CapEx are concerned, it will have some impact on EBIT and cost. But fortunately for us, that should not significantly affect because we have while doing a model -- yes, we have factored in slight changes in construction costs in terms of contingencies. We have actively changed to interest rate. Most importantly, even the rents are going up. So that [ should net ] negative.
To complete the point. Prestige has done more secondary transactions on rental assets than anyone else. So just your thoughts. If the policy rates were to move up 100, 150 basis points, do you think the transaction value with cap rates also move up in the secondary market? Your best -- I know you don't have too much to sell anyways, but how would the market look at cap rates?
So it will get factored in, but we don't have right now anything that we are selling substantially in the secondary market. That is something which we have sold. Even last year, sales overall, if you look at it, there's nothing that has come significantly from commercial.
But to answer your question, will it get factored in? Yes, it will.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Ashutosh Mittal from Axis Capital.
So what is the [indiscernible] projects which does not get consolidated? And what is the Prestige share in [indiscernible]? Specifically what is the debt on Ocean Crest, [indiscernible] 101 and [indiscernible]?
There are 2 projects that definitely has not come for consolidation. One is a company called Pandora, which has got INR 500 crores of debt, 50% is [indiscernible]. And there is other project which is a hotel in Delhi, Aerocity, Bamboo, where we won 50%, and that has not come for consolidation. These 2.
And what is the investment that we have made in Marine Lines? So far, we have made investment of INR 325 crores in Marine Lines. And that project, we should be able to launch in Q2.
The next question is from the line of Parikshit Kandpal from HDFC Securities.
Congratulations on a very strong year. So my first question is on the Mumbai sales. So now you have put together all these 3 projects. So how much will be the total achieved by now?
Mumbai project sales? Irfan said earlier while answering that the momentum has been very good. The launch has [indiscernible]. So we're compiling the numbers. Ideally, once the quarter is over, next quarter results, we'll tell you the numbers, but there is a very good momentum and especially [ the 3 ] [indiscernible] doing very well.
And did you ask what the pipeline for Mumbai next?
My question was for the full year as a whole, FY '23. So do we -- can we expect like Mumbai to contribute close to about INR 3,000 crores of retail for a year as a whole?
No, it should easily give us about INR 3,000 crores. That is our thing, maybe more. But as things stand and as things look for the financial year, though we launched it only middle of this quarter, I think we should get those numbers pretty easily.
Okay. This is the second question was again on volume. So how much of -- so we have taken some of the old area which was earlier being developed. So how much of this will we accrue on account of that to us, like with the opening of the book of sales?
Yes. I mean that's a good question. See, we, at the moment, we are not counting those old sales that have already happened. And if it's for accounting purposes, at some point of time, we'll also segregate and say these are the new sales; these have come from the -- because of the old sales historically. And of course, in terms of value, there will be much, much less because those have been sold as the historical numbers. Of course, we need to look at it, and we need to see even collection comes from that. But whenever we declare our June results, we definitely disappoint, that I think Venkat and Amit also have to make a notice, segregate the number so that you also will know we're just not showing you some historical sale and saying it's already [ that ]. So I'm very confident now because until the launch did happen, we were not sure how the response will be. Now once the response has been good, very confidently we can say that Mumbai also has accepted us.
Okay. And just last one, Venkat, on the business development in Mumbai. So if you can just walk us through how much has been the total GDV addition till now including these 3 projects. And beyond that, how much do you think Mumbai has the potential for you in terms of GDV growth. Because if I broadly what's my number, it should be excess of INR 20,000 crores, so if you can just walk us through like how?
GDV from what?
In my estimate, I think it's almost crossing INR 20,000 crores of GDV now, so with [ this shift shy even after ] project. So can you help us like what is the total GDV calling to you for the Mumbai project? Currently 9 and upcoming months.
So if you take Jijamata Nagar potential that it has, we will be at around -- I'm talking about residential alone.
Okay, yes, yes. That is for [indiscernible] I asked.
For residential alone, we should be around INR 25,000 crores number. And INR 3,000 annually could be a potential which we can do like -- because there's a huge number. So it's almost like 8 years kind of inventory. So that will be -- we'll be able to bring a 3 years of momentum. This is what we are looking that. And offering also is limited to big projects. That's a minimum number. Now if you were to launch this Ocean Crest at Marine Lines, that's a different market altogether, micromarket. That sales also will get added. And [ Shipshine ], we should be able to launch during this fiscal. Only Jijamata Nagar will not happen this year, but maybe year after next.
So it's not that we'll be stagnant at INR 3,000 crores for us to apply INR 3,000 as a denominator. That offering increases and the Prestige numbers also will go up.
And just one last thing on the total fee sale last year of 10,000-odd. So how much of that was charter sales? Because I understand BKC, there was some start-up sale which was done. Similarly, I think in Bangalore, so if you can just break up the total, how much is the commercial startup pay and how much is the [ fee revenues ]?
Our competitive around 8.5% to 9% is our commercial startup fee. That's not in residential.
It's close to about INR 900 crores or so?
So INR 9,000 crores -- yes, that is around INR 800 crores to INR 900 crores. That's all residential.
And it's more to do with financing it more with equity rather than putting in debt. So it's more like a strategy where you want to fund the project through equity, as you said earlier?
Correct. That is correct.
Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Thank you again for a very enthusiastic and insightful conference we had. As we said, we are always on a positive mindset and you would have seen quarter-on-quarter, year-on-year, there has been positive for stuff that we've been doing. And we will continue to do that. And your encouragement and participation is always required. And the whole team is working hard. We are focused, and I believe things will only get better.
With this, I'll ask Venkat to conclude.
Thank you. Thank you, sir, and thanks, everyone, for the very active participation. And your inputs have been a very good [indiscernible] in terms of evolving our business models and directionally, listen at what all can we do.
This, we believe, are the most exciting time, and our teams are geared up to capitalize on the opportunities and the consolidation theme that is played out, and our expansion to various geographies is meeting with good response. So we're quite excited.
In the next 3 years, we believe are going to be very defining. And we will do our best to capture and sustain the numbers that we're going to achieve. We look forward to your support, and thank you.
And any of you having the -- any questions post this call, please feel free to write to us, reach out to me and Amit. Thank you.
Thank you. On behalf of Axis Capital Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.