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NTPC Ltd
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On behalf of Motilal Oswal Financial Services, I welcome you all to the Q4 and annual FY '21 Earnings Conference Call of NTPC. We are joined today by the senior management of NTPC led by Director Finance, Mr. A.K. Gautam. Without further ado, I would now hand over the call to Mr. Gautam and would request him to introduce the management team followed by his opening remarks and the Q&A session. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Aniket. Am I clear?
Yes, sir, you are.
Okay. Thank you very much. A very good evening to everybody. I, A.K. Gautam, Director Finance, welcome all of you to the Q4 FY '21 phone call of NTPC Limited. NTPC continues to provide [ unsustained ] support to the nation by ensuring uninterrupted supply of power even during the second wave of COVID-19 recently witnessed by India. Before I move further, I would like to introduce Shri Dillip Kumar Patel, Director, Human Resources; Shri Ramesh Babu, Director Operations; Shri Chandan Kumar Mondol, Director, Commercial; and Shri Ujjwal Kanti Bhattacharya, Director of Projects. I also have with me other key members of NTPC team. Today, the company has announced the audited financial results for FY '21, along with the unaudited financial results for Q4 FY '21. The key performance highlights for the financial year and quarter ended 31 March 2021 have also been disclosed on both the stock exchanges. Now I will touch upon certain operational highlights for Q4 and 12 months of FY '21. NTPC standalone and group recorded highest ever annual and quarterly generation in FY '21. NTPC's stand-alone growth generation in Q4 FY '21 is 77.63 billion units as compared to 68.27 billion units in the corresponding previous quarter. And for FY '21, it is 270.91 billion units as compared to 259.62 billion units in the corresponding previous period, registering an increase of 13.71% and 4.35%, respectively. Gross generation of NTPC Group in Q4 FY '21 is 91.67 billion units as compared to 76.01 billion units. And in FY '21, it is 314.07 billion units as compared to 290.19 billion units in the corresponding previous period, registering an increase of 20.59% and 8.23%, respectively. NTPC standalone and group recorded highest day generation of over 990.65 million units and 1.19 billion units on 20 March 2021 and 19 March 2021, respectively. In Q4 FY '21, we have added 1,975 megawatt commercial capacity, which included 800 megawatt at Gadarwara, 660 megawatt at Meja, 300 megawatts at NEEPCO, 210-megawatt solar capacity at Bilhaur and [ 5 ] megawatt solar capacity at Auraiya. After running 54 years, operations of 460 megawatts, Talcher Thermal Power Station have been discontinued with effect from 31 March 2021. With this, the commercial capacity of NTPC has become 51,725 megawatt on a stand-alone basis and 6,490 megawatts for the group as on 31 March 2021. NTPC Group, being a leader in the power sector has a strong commitment towards renewable energy and would be targeting RE capacity of 60 gigawatt by FY 2032. Our Board has already approved a business plan in this regard. NTPC Group has already commissioned 1,350 megawatts of RE projects under EPC mode. 2,884 megawatt of solar projects including ongoing projects of NTPC REL are presently under implementation and 3,290 megawatt are in various stages of tendering. For FY '21, 4 coal stations of NTPC were among the top 10 performing stations in the country in terms of PLF. It includes Korba with 93.66%, Sipat with 90.12%, Rihand with 89.04% and Vindhyachal with 88.73% PLF. NTPC's labs [indiscernible] unit, Singrauli Unit 1 and Korba Unit 2 recorded highest annual PLF of 100.40% and 100.06%. During FY '21, PLF for coal stations of NTPC was 66% as against the national average of 54.56%, thereby maintaining a spread of over 11%. During the period, we have suffered losses due to grid restrictions and field supply. The generation loss due to grid restrictions in coal-based stations was 94.12 billion units in FY '21. For the gas stations, the loss was 28.29 billion units. The generation loss on account of fuel supply constrained towards 0.18 billion units in FY '21. Now the status of supply of fuel. During the FY '21, materialization of coal against ACQ was 86.87% as against 92.95% in FY '20. Coal supply during FY '21 was 170.37 million metric tonnes, comprising of 169.29 million metric tonne of domestic coal and 1.08 million metric tonne of imported coal. The coal supply during the corresponding previous period was 173.67 million metric tonne with 170.67 MMT of domestic coal and 3 MMT of imported coal. Despite COVID-19 pandemic and the stoppage of work for about 94 days at Pakri Barwadih mine, NTPC has achieved a total coal production of 11 million metric tonnes during FY '21. FY '20 was 11.15 metric tonnes. Cumulatively, 32.36 million metric tonne of coal has been activated from Pakri Barwadih, Dulanga and Talaipalli coal mines till 31 March 2021. Cumulative expenditure of INR 8,182.87 crores has been incurred on the development of coal mines till 31 March 2021. An MOU was signed between DVC and NTPC renewable energy for setting up of floating solar PV park and projects in the reservoirs under the command area of BBC in Jharkhand and West Bengal. These projects are under UMREPP and CPSU scheme of the Ministry of New and Renewable Energy, GoI. Power management consultancy assignment under ISF platform was secured for 500 megawatts in Republic of Mali in June 2020, and 100 megawatt in Republic of Malawi in March 2021. Very recently, Cuba has also appointed NTPC as PMC for 900-megawatt solar park. With this, the total capacity under implementation is now 1,785 megawatts, including earlier secured 285-megawatt with Republic of Togo.NTPC has collaborated for international business through signing of MoUs with [ EG and Co ], Malawi, IOCL, Inter RAO export of Russia, Bank of Muscat of Oman and Masen of Morocco. Through this route, NTPC intends to have more effective projects in the respective focus region so as to contribute further in the power sector development. Now environment management. Initiatives for preserving environment taken by NTPC include flue gas desulfurization systems are under various stages of implementation for 64.39 gigawatt of group capacity. FGD systems have already been commissioned for 1,340 megawatt capacity. FGD system package for 58.94 gigawatt capacity are under implementation and FGD system package 4.11 gigawatt capacity are under various stages of tendering. For compliance with NOx control, combustion modification has already been implemented at 16 units with 7.44 gigawatt of thermal power capacity. Supply and installation of low NOx combustion system for 14 gigawatt of capacity is under implementation. Now I will touch upon the financial highlights. Gross sales of FY '21 is INR 99,039.63 crores as against previous year gross sales of INR 97,443.33 crores, registering an increase of 1.64%. Total income for FY '21 is INR 1,03,552.71 crores as against previous year total income of INR 1,00,478.41 crores, registering an increase of 3.06%. For FY '21, NTPC has registered its highest ever PAT of INR 13,769.52 crores as against INR 10,112.81 crore in the corresponding previous year, registering an increase of 36.16%. For FY '21, the Board has recommended final dividend of 31.5% of the paid up capital. That is INR 3.15 per share, subject to the approval of the shareholders in the Annual General Meeting. As you are aware, interim dividend for the financial year 2021 at the rate of 30% of the paid up capital, that is INR 3 per share has already been paid in February 2021. Now an update on various other financial activities. The regulated equity as on 31 March '21, was INR 66,337.94 crores. Total assets of the company stood at INR 3,43,219.39 crores as at 31 March 2021, as against INR 3,27,667.45 crores as at 31 March 2020. The gross block has increased by INR 18,659.35 crores to INR 2,11,557.37 crores as at 31 March 2021, mainly on account of capitalization of new units. Capital work in progress, including advances, stood at INR 80,679.63 crores as of 31 March 2021 as compared to INR 77,881.03 crores as of 31 March 2020. At the group level, capital work in progress, including advances, stood at INR 1,05,778.44 crores as at 31 March 2021 compared to INR 1,05,411.92 crores as at 31 March 2020. Regarding fund mobilization. During Q4 of FY '21, NTPC had issued bonds with a door-to-door maturity of 10 years aggregating to INR 2,500 crores at attractive coupon of 6.43% on 27 January 2021. NTPC has signed its syndicated term loan in euro equivalent to USD 260 million on 23 March 2021 with a consortium of State Bank of India, Frankfurt branch, Bank of Baroda, IFSC GIFT City branch and Sumitomo Mitsui Banking Corporation, Singapore branch. The facility had a door-to-door maturity of 7 years. Average cost of borrowing for FY '21 is 6.24% as against 6.81% in FY '20. Now a small brief about the CapEx. In FY '21, we have incurred a CapEx of INR 20,338.68 crores on a stand-alone basis and total group CapEx of INR 33,981.64 crores. The capital outlay for FY '21, '22 on a stand-alone basis has been estimated at INR 23,736 crores for NTPC. Now I will talk about certain -- about the commercial issues in NTPC. NTPC has realized more than 100% of the build amount crossing INR 1,00,000 crores during the year, which is the highest ever realization. Further, the trade receivables are maintained at the level of 50 days sales. Now I will briefly touch upon some NTPC group companies. NVVN, our trading subsidy, transacted 18.54 billion units during the FY '21 as against 14.53 billion units during the FY '20, registering a growth of 28%. This is the highest our trading volume achieved by NVVN. NVVN has signed an MOU with South Delhi Municipal Corporation for implementing rooftop solar projects of -- and 20-megawatt ground-mounted solar projects along with charging infrastructure development. CIL, NTPC Urja Private Limited bagged its first assignment of project formation for setting up 50-megawatt solar power project in Nigahi coal mines of Northern Coalfields Limited. It is a major step towards green energy by the 2 major PSUs. NTPC and CIL, joining hands to create such projects, utilizing CIL's vacant land and NTPC expertise. NTPC will act as a project management consultant for this solar project. During the FY '21, we have accounted dividend income of INR 1,283.18 crores from our subsidy and joint venture companies as against INR 210.40 crores received during FY '21. NTPC continues to win laurels and awards in various fields. Major awards received in Q4 FY '21 are as follows: NTPC received Role Model Award at 11th CII National HR Excellence Award 2021. This award will be the highest level of recognition in the field of human resource by CIL. This is the second time when the award of Role Model has been conferred to any organization. This award has been given after a period of 10 years to any organization. NTPC has been confirmed with the Certificate of Appreciation for Best Corporate Social Responsibility Practice & COVID-19 Relief. NTPC has been confirmed with CSR Leadership Award under the category of Best Corporate Social Responsibility Practices by World CSR Day Organisation. NTPC has been awarded for Innovative Training Practices by ISTD. NTPC has won the prestigious ISTD Award in learning and display for the innovative training practices for the year, financial year '19 and financial year '20. NTPC has been ranked as #1 by [ GEM ] under CPSC category. NTPC has also achieved second rank under the number of distinct projects on [ GEM ] during FY '21. Apart from this, NTPC has been selected as the Best Place to Work yesterday only by GPTW. These were some of the highlights I wanted to share before we begin with the question-and-answer session. Thank you.
[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from DAM Capital.
Congratulations on good set of numbers. Sir, my first question is other income is way too high and the finance cost is slightly lower Q-o-Q, and employee benefit expenses are also low in Q-o-Q and Y-o-Y. Can you please explain the reason behind it? And what is the adjusted PAT?
I will talk to your questions. One is regarding other income is, why the other income is high. Other income is high on accounting late payment surcharge and accounting of dividend, mainly dividend from the joint venture and subsidy companies. Now employee cost decrease is mainly due to retirement of certain of the employees and increase in the PRP [ ex-gratia ] in the previous year. Then we come to interest and finance charges. Decrease is on account of exchange difference -- positive exchange difference that is rupee appreciation against the dollar and JPY loan. But against this decrease, a corresponding minus entry is also appearing in the regulated, movement in rate regulated deferral account. So you have to consider both the items together. If you consider that also, it would be a minimal increase -- minimal decrease in the interest and finance charges.
Understood. My second question is -- sir, my second question is on the renewable capacity. What is the renewable capacity operational pipeline and even of FY '21 with PPA? And secondly, what do you mean by capacity under tendering? Does it mean that 3-gigawatt capacity in a tendering has got a PPA or this is without PPA?
I will request Mr. Mohit, who is the Executive Director, to answer this question.
The installed capacity today is about [ 13 40 ] megawatts. And the capacity under construction is 3,019 megawatts. All of these have PPAs, except [ 1 25 ] megawatts. The capacity which is under tendering does not have a PPA right now.
The next question is from the line of Ajinkya Bhat from Macquarie.
Can you hear me?
Yes. Yes, yes.
I just wanted to check a couple of things. Number one, did you say that the renewable capacity targets have now been increased to 60 gigawatts by 2022?
Yes.
And so sir, on that background, just a couple of things. Number one, so your earlier target was to reach say 30, 32 gigawatt to its total installed capacity of 130 gigawatts. Now let's say that goes to 60 gigawatts renewable in, say, 150 gigawatt total capacity. So even, say, 10 years down the line, your renewable capacity would be about 40% of installed versus 60% thermal. So that's still probably not meeting the criteria of, let's say, various ESG funds. So have you thought about it? Is there any plan or thought process about some sort of spinoff of this renewable NPV going forward? Obviously, it might be too early to talk about it, but have you thought about it or discussed about with the Board?
No. I think probably you missed the point. It has already been mentioned that NTPC has created a wholly-owned subsidiary for renewable, NTPC Renewable Energy Limited, which is now operational. And generally, all of our new greenfield capacity is being put out to this subsidiary only.
In addition to that, we have also signed a joint venture agreement with NIIF for development of solar power projects.
Yes, yes. And as the [indiscernible]...
I basically meant that not -- so I understand you have a separate subsidiary, but is there any plan or thought process about spending it off in the sense that listing it separately from the current NTPC structure? That was my question. Listing is [indiscernible]...
Yes. Yes, we are thinking on those lines.
Okay. Okay. And sir, secondly, the second question is, how has been the competitive intensity in the renewable tenders that are out in the market, especially considering the fact that some of the other PSU companies, such as Coal India have also expressed desire -- basically, they are also getting into the solar power plants. And in renewables, the biggest cost item is basically the interest cost where all the PSUs might be on a similar footing, enjoying better cost of debt compared to private operators. So other PSUs getting into it, is that increasing competitive intensity for you? That's my last question.
That is there, but still NTPC is in the advantageous position so far as arranging of low-cost finances are concerned. So that advantage is always available in NTPC. And with this, we expect that we will get some priority in the tenders.
Okay. Okay. So no specific increase in intensity -- competitive intensity from other PSUs or at least not yet is what you're saying?
Yes. We are not thinking on those lines.
The next question is from the line of Vishal Biraia from Aviva Insurance.
Sir, 2, 3 questions. Why was the [ morning ] limit announced? Are there any acquisitions in store? Could you break up the composition of -- I mean, could you build the composition of FY '22 CapEx that you outlined at about INR 200 crores -- at about INR 230 crores -- INR 23,000 crores?
INR 23,000 crores.
Yes. Sorry, yes.
Yes. Actually, the capital announcement has been done considering the merger and acquisitions because 2 of our subsidiary companies, that is Nabinagar and Kanti, they are likely to be merged with NTPC in the next year. So their borrowing costs will be -- also be included in NTPC. And you were also -- you just mentioned that we have also considered a capacity -- this CapEx of INR 23,736 crores. In addition, we also increased this for any acquisitions, which may carry out in the field of RE or any other acquisition, business combination acquisitions.
Okay. And of the INR 23,000 crores of CapEx that you plan for FY '20, what portion of this could be for thermal and what proportion for RE?
Right now that -- I think, we -- I just cannot tell you, but you can obtain this separately from Aditya Dar.
Okay. And any targets for CapEx for FY '23, '24 that you can point out?
'23, '24 CapEx.
We are working at something like INR 22,000 right now, but we are in the process of preparing our [ B ] and area of [indiscernible]. The numbers will be more clear by 31st of August.
The next question is from the line of Rahul Modi from ICICI Securities.
Congratulations. So just 2 questions I had, sir, mainly on RE. Sir, any time lines on the CPSU tender which we were expecting the 5,000-megawatt tender? And over the next 2, 3 or 4 months, what are the quantum of tenders, both solar and [ will ] hybrid if we are participating in that could potentially come up for bidding?
The CPSU scheme, tender has been postponed to 30 June, and we expect that it shall be -- our submission date [indiscernible]. So we hope for that to happen then. As regards to upcoming tenders, the point of view in the pipeline, we are looking at bidding of around close to 5,000 megawatts in the upcoming tender. Of course, that will also depend on how the rates work out.
The next question is from the line Atul Tiwari from Citigroup.
Sir, is it possible to share consolidated regulated equity?
You can get it from Aditya Dar separately.
Sir, actually, I have tried in the past and from how it appears that it is not really available. So I mean, because now obviously NTPC Group is much bigger than NTPC standalone. So it would great if you could like make it a part of your -- the press release. So there is 1 critical number that we always miss. And actually, in the previous conference call also, it has been told to us that we can get it separately, but somehow it is not available.
Okay. It will be around INR 84,000 crores.
Okay, sir. So that helps. And sir, what was the total receivable and [ overdue receivable ], if you remember, as of FY '21?
Receivable -- he is asking -- actually, your voice was cracking. I think you were asking about the total receivables side as 31 March 2021?
Yes, sir. And overdue receivable.
Total receivable as of 31 March was INR 12,000...
750.
750 crores. And beyond, the due date was INR 6,500 crores.
Okay. And sir, what was the number last financial year, March '20, just for company?
March '20, it was -- total dues were INR 14,189 and overdue amount was INR 9,585.
Sir, INR 9,580?
INR 9,585.
The next question is from the line of Sumit Kishore from Axis Capital.
I have a few questions. The first one, could you elaborate on your target of 60 gigawatts by 2032 and the road map to achieving that? Can we have a 2-year target or a 3-year target as well, particularly because we have heard of targets on the solar and renewable side for 2022 4 or 5 years back, but clearly, we are nowhere close to achieving that. Also, have you reviewed your thermal targets over a 10-year time frame? And what can we expect over a 3- to 4-year time frame beyond what is already under construction? That's my first question.
Okay. So in FY '21, we will be adding 1 gigawatt; FY '22, 3 gigawatts; FY '23, 8 gigawatt; FY '24, 15 gigawatt. These are cumulative numbers.
Okay. So your capacity by FY '24 will be 15 gigawatt is what I understand.
Yes, yes, yes.
And FY '22, what did you say, sir?
3.
Okay, okay, okay. This is very clear. So basically, you are saying that if India -- you are going to get to 15 gigawatt by FY '24, so 1.4 gigawatt as on date, you're going to add 13 gigawatt in the next 3 financial years. What do you think is the size of the Indian market on an annual basis in terms of solar installations? And I'm assuming FY '24, 15 gigawatt will be our installed capacity. So we are at 95 gigawatt as a country on renewables, 40 gigawatt is solar. So please tell us by FY '24, what do you think the Indian solar capacity will go from 40 gigawatt to? Because it appears like a very big number for NTPC to do versus past track records.
We did 10%.
Yes. I think, again, you'll be asking very speculative question. But broadly, the intent of the government of India is to bid out close to 20 gigawatts every year. However, how much of that actually comes through depends on how things work out maybe by the agencies like SECI and other, that's one.
Yes. If you take 20 gigawatts, it will be 60 gigawatts in 3 years, of which NTPC will do 13 gigawatts. So that is the market share that we should be looking at.
No, I think that's not a correct assumption. When we're talking about 14 or 15 gigawatts, we need to assume that these are the capacities, which will come online, which means some of these capacities are already won or under implementation. And some of these will be under bidding, so it's a mix of both.
That is clear. On the thermal side, can you please tell us have you reviewed your thermal target over that time frame of 2022 or the old target remains? Because we're clearly seeing that the appetite for fresh coal plant build-out has gone off meaningfully.
We are going ahead with our ongoing projects. And as per the construction schedule, we are going to achieve 6,092 of total capacity, out of which [ Auraiya ] will be 1,062. If I knock it out, around 5,000 megawatt will be the thermal capacity, given the NTPC and JVs taken together, group basis. And if you ask me, standalone NTPC, then thermal capacity addition is to the tune of 2,370. That is by 31st March 2022.
No, sir. I was meaning to say by 2022, when -- earlier, you had a target of 132 gigawatt by 2022. So as a previous participant said, is that target now become 162 gigawatt by 2032 as in your thermal capacity addition plans have not changed at all? Or have they changed?
I'll tell you, this solar projection of 60 gigawatt has been met and that is our plan for the solar. And our 1 lakh 30,000 megawatts, we have not changed so far because we are waiting for the newly considered committee under CEE by the government of India to look at the demand-and-supply projections. Once that comes every year or so, we'll look into our number and accordingly restructure it.
So my second question is on the impact of implementation of MBED on NTPC. Could you also cover the potential impact on PLF incentives or savings on interest on working capital? The technical challenges, which are foreseen on implementation of MBED starting 1st April 2020.
Actually, MBED knows government of India has given some guidelines. I think the still detailed procedure is yet to be evolved. And there are certain issues which will be addressed, I think, in the detailed procedure. As far as NTPC is concerned, since fixed charge is already protected, we don't envisage there will be any problem in case of MBED.
Okay. So basically, you think that April '22 is a time line that can be met? Or do you foresee this?
No, we cannot say right now because this will all depend on whether discounts are giving consent to these or not because, ultimately, they have to give consent because they have to have working capital upfront for getting payment. So it will not depend on the discount they'll be giving consent or not.
Okay. Finally, thanks for the dividend of INR 6.15 in FY '21. Could you articulate your dividend policy hereon? What percentage of profit or how do you see the payouts going forward in light of the CapEx plan that you have?
Actually, our dividend policy, we have been telling in the past it is governed by the DIPAM guidelines, which says 30% of profit or 5% of network, whichever is higher. So we will continue to follow those guidelines.
So you're already doing better than those guidelines. So I was wondering whether those guidelines were relevant when there was no dividend tax applicable on the dividends. So because that is no longer applicable, those guidelines are outdated now. So in light of that, could you...
No, no. Those guidelines are not yet outdated. I mean, the government of India, DIPAM, they continuously ask regarding compliance of those guidelines. Even today also, we have mentioned in our Board. In addition to that, we are also doing buyback also, 2%.
Yes, yes. No, I think because NTPC has actually done better than the DIPAM guidelines. So that is why I was saying whether we should stick to the DIPAM guidelines or should have our independent NTPC dividend payout policy.
As of now, it is DIPAM guidelines.
The next question is from the line of Girish Achhipalia from MS Company.
I had a couple of questions. So firstly, on the renewable side, before the monetization of subsidiary happens, is it fair to assume that all your renewable assets wherever you're raising debt will continue to be in the stand-alone parent entity and you'll continue to have some advantage on the cost of borrowing?
No, I think it has been -- in previous questions, it has been told by Mr. Mohit that for renewable energy, a separate subsidy -- wholly owned subsidy, NTPC Renewable Energy has been created. Apart from that, we have also signed a joint venture agreement with NIIF. So far as this wholly owned subsidy is concerned, we expect that they will continue to enjoy a similar rate of interest as NTPC is getting from the market.
Okay. Second, sir, right now, you are outsourcing EPC. Is there a possibility as the size of the renewable tenders become bigger, that you in-house renewable capacity in terms of EPC and O&M?
Mohit?
Yes. So EPC will continue, but of course, we are looking at getting the packages so that we can buy some of the items separately also. So that's already started happening in 1 or 2 tenders. Going ahead, that will also be considered in view of the competition. O&M is already in-house. It's being done in-house by NTPC.
Okay. The third one was just around dividends. Is there a thought process on quarterly dividends going forward from this year onwards? Any light that you can share on that?
As of now, we have not thought on those lines.
The next question is from the line of Anuj Upadhyay from HDFC Securities.
Sir, 2, 3 questions. First, on the under-recovery part. Could you just mention what was under recovery for FY '21 with service last year?
In this FY '21, it is INR 601 crores as against INR 249 crores in the corresponding previous year. In Q4 FY '21, it is INR 31 crores. In the corresponding previous year, it was incentive of INR 130 crores.
Okay. Any specific reason, sir, for the rise in under-recovery because initially what the management has guided that probably we would settle out somewhere close to INR 350 crores to INR 400 crores in FY '21, but [ that's how we'll want to on the record ].
The main reason is because of 3 units, 1 at Darlipali, there was at Lara and Kahalgaon. In Darlipali and Lara, these are new units, new stations. There were some initial stabilization issues. Therefore, we had some leakages in the boiler and also a turbine issue. So therefore, that has -- with the [indiscernible], Head of Under Recovery. And in case of Kahalgaon, there was a dike breach and that took -- we had to stop some of our units. But right now, these issues are settled. All these stations are back to normal, and they're running about 90% [indiscernible]. Those are the reasons. And in addition to do that, there are around -- because of COVID, there are 2 stations where we had done the overhauling. That overhauling -- during the overhauling, because of COVID, the time has extended and we are actually approaching CRC for -- with petition -- with a petition. But we'll be able to get around INR 26 crores back on that. So we may, in these 3 stations, contribute around INR 550 crores.
That's helpful, sir. And could you throw some light on the capacities, which are likely to achieve commercialization of COD in FY '22 and '23, sir?
For the year 2022, we have a target of capacity addition NTPC stand-alone basis, INR 2,370 crores Thermal; JV and subsidiary, INR 1,860 crores...
But sir, plant-wise. Plant-wise, sir. It would be helpful if you can provide plant-wise, sir, which are the plants which we expect this year.
I can right now give you the name of the plant on the thermal side and later we can give you -- Mr. Aditya can give you further details. Like NTPC Unit 2, the COD will be achieved sometime in July we are expecting. [ Dondai ] Unit 6 we are in the process of declaring COD in June itself this month. Barauni Unit 9, July is our target of this year. Darlipali Unit 2, we are just going to start the trial operation from tomorrow and expected to do the COD in July '21. Barh Unit 1, we are targeting September '21. [ BRBCL ] Unit 4, October '21. And NPGCL Unit 3, we are attempting somewhere in March 2022. Then Rourkela, which is through our joint venture, our target is last quarter of this financial year. And Durgapur is 40-megawatt through NSPCL again joint venture sometime in March of '22. This is the target as of now, on the thermal station base. [indiscernible] 1,062 confirmed by March '22, but we are looking for adding some more possibilities here and we'll look into that, which will be clearer by end of next quarter.
Right. And for FY '23, sir?
For '23, we'll just tell you later. And definitely, I can give you some names like [indiscernible] Unit 1 and [indiscernible] Unit 2. And then NTPC -- and North Karanpura 2 units, both the Unit 1 and Unit 2; Barh Unit #2, 660 megawatt. And there is one project we are doing outside India, that Bangladesh-India Friendship Power Company Limited. One unit we'll be doing definitely this year; another we are trying to do at the last quarter of this year, else in the next year definitely. That makes this 4,900 total megawatt of thermal capacity. [ Auraiya ], based on the new plan, we'll come up with the details and we'll let you know.
So you mentioned that doubling of the renewable target to [ 50 ] gigawatt, is this by 2032? Am I right, the time line?
Yes, yes.
Okay. Sir, by far, we are aware that the 2 major solar powers, which are coming up in Gujarat and Rajasthan would add somewhere around 10 to 12 gigawatts of capacity to our portfolio. And now as we have doubled our target, so could you just mention which are those states or areas where we are eyeing this major capacity to summer?
Yes, you're right. The main capacities will come up in Gujarat and Rajasthan. Then we are also pursuing with Andhra Pradesh and Maharashtra, so these are 2 other areas. But we are quite hopeful that in Rajasthan the number will increase further as more [ capacity ] comes from the government side to release land for these areas. So these will largely contribute because these have the best potential in terms of solar.
Okay. One last question, sir. While the quarter has witnessed a significant double-digit growth in generation, but that is not getting earlier expected on the revenue front. Just throw some light on that, sir? Because even at the EBITDA level [ remain as ] flat. So the earning growth is largely fueled by higher other income, falling interest expenses and the tax credit which we have [ distributed ] in the past.
Actually, if you see, EBITDA just alone basis you cannot compare because certain portion of the Vivad Se Vishwas Scheme has reduced my sales in the quarter. So that is to be excluded because the corresponding item is appearing in the provision for tax. So if you eliminate both 2, then you can see the EBITDA or you have to see the adjusted profit.
Could you quantify, sir, what would that be? Or if still [indiscernible]?
I think Aditya will give you separately.
The next question is from the line of Subhadip Mitra from JM Financial.
Just wanted to understand what would be the adjusted PAT number for FY '21 and for the fourth quarter?
Okay. It will be -- FY '21 will be INR 14,218.07 crores as against INR 12,173.49 crores.
Okay. And for the 4Q?
Q4 will be INR 3,831 crores as against INR 2,924 crores.
The next question is from the line of Dhruv from HDFC Fund.
Yes, sir. Sir, in the segmental accounting, if I see the other segment, the generation -- you have 2 segments, the generation and others. The others have a significant drop this year on a full year basis. So what is causing this?
I think in the others, it's...
Generally, it is a consistent number. This time it has come down significant.
No, no. Actually, it is coming because of this THDC and NEEPCO loans, which we have taken that is coming under the others in segment.
But that would be in the finance cost in the segment. I'm looking at the stand-alone number.
Stand-alone segment, you are seeing which portion? Others?
The others -- you have generation and others. So others used to be around INR 400 -- INR 300 to 500-odd number generally. This time, it is around minus INR 34 crores.
Dhruv, we will give you this -- actually we have created some provisions with respect to certain mines, which have been deallocated.
Okay, okay. So in your adjusted PAT number, you would be adjusting for that number?
No, you are in segment result or you are asking adjusted PAT number?
Segment result only. Sir, I'm asking for the segment result only. But -- so this number you will adjust in the -- when you report -- when you give the adjusted PAT number, this number will be just adjusted, too. The provisional number will be adjusted.
Definitely, yes.
Sir, in the earlier comment you mentioned that the other income is high because of dividend income. But if I look at the consolidated other income also, PAT number is also decently high, about INR 1,500 crores, INR 1,600 crores versus the run rate of INR 500 crores to INR 600 crores.
Because in consolidated also, those companies are also getting dividends. I'm not -- I told this is on account of 2 items. One is the dividend from JV subsidy companies. In the consolidated, that will be eliminated. But the second item is late payment surcharge, that will continue to appear in both the consolidated as well as stand-alone accounts.
Sir, so what would be late payment in 4Q?
Late payment surcharge in?
Late payment surcharge in 4Q -- in your fourth quarter?
Yes. For the year, it is INR 1,633 crores -- sorry, it was in March '20. In March '21, it is INR 2,316 crores. If you see quarter, it is INR 620 crores in the current quarter as against INR 393 crores in the previous quarter.
Okay. And sir, 1 question -- 2 small questions. One was on the Telangana issue, I recently note that you have got an NGT order. So sir, would that -- is that stopping your work? And could this result in a delay in the project execution?
No.
So the work continues?
Yes. We have already approached to the Supreme Court of India against the order of NGT.
So the work is not -- the case can continue. And by the time, you can continue to work on it.
That has happened in Kudgi also.
Got it, got it. And the last question was on the RE business. This is similar to what one participant asked earlier. So we have done a reasonable work in the solar segment and have gotten some edge there. But it seems the incremental bid that would be coming out is still probably in the wind or in the storage side. So how are we -- do you see that as a hurdle for us? Or if not, then how are we preparing for wind or storage because that has not been there for us in the past.
Yes. We are looking at wind also as well as hybrid and solar. So these are things, which will depend on how many bids do come out. Depending on that, we are working on this side as well. And portions or parcels of land, which we are trying to tie up with government and also those which also have a reasonable or decent wind potential. That is how we propose to tackle this.
But as such, getting hybrid contracts and executing them versus what you were doing in solar, you don't see that as a hurdle or as a significant challenge?
See, every project is done in that way. So you can't say that projects are not [indiscernible] whether it's solar or wind because we go through the [indiscernible] and we engage capable parties to include that so we don't really feel that as a challenge.
The next question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from DAM Capital.
Sir, my first question is are we looking to tender out Lara, Talcher and Singrauli]? Do you think this gets postponed given the current environment? And second question is, are you achieving a ramp rate in all these stations? I think the ramp rate the regulation kicked in from April '21. Do you see any adverse or -- any adverse impact on the profit on account of that? And third, sir, what are we trying to ensure that under-recovery is reduced to bare minimum in FY '22?
Last question, first. Yes.
Lara, we're able to achieve the ramp rate except in the Barauni 110-megawatt and Vindhyachal 210-megawatts. Other than these 2 stations and units, everywhere we're seeing ramp rates. So therefore, we don't see any issue in achieving the ramp rate. Regarding the [ AFT ] under-recovery, since these 2 units we had, as I said in Lara and Darlipali, we did have a problem. So based on this feedback, we have considered a special team for improving the quality during construction. And this team is going through all the now upcoming projects and ensuring that these things will not be repeated. Second, the Kahalgaon where the dyke incident happened, again we have made a team at our corporate center so that these things can be taken care of. More compliance, more supervision will be there, so that we can eliminate this AF channel.
Regarding Talcher, Lara and Singrauli expansion, we'll tell you an ambivalent answer. We are[Technical Difficulty]
Sorry for that, sir. Please go ahead.
I'll again repeat. Regarding expansion through award of Talcher, Lara and Singrauli. Talcher, we are almost ready. We are looking for Government of Odisha permission and clearances. And we are also looking at the last moment discussion with the bidders. Regarding Lara, we are awaiting environment clearance from Ministry of Environment and Forest. Similarly, we have received the clearance. We are looking at the specifications and preparing the specifications. In fact, we have gone for technical bidding first stage also for that. But with one rider, as I said, that we are waiting for the Government of India CEA Committee to come out with the Indian scenario by 2030. We are ramping up on the RE sites. We are giving more stress on the greener power. Whatever is the demand gap required to fill fast based on coal and fossil fuel, we'll go by that Government of India study and try to take that. This is the position today.
Do you have some more questions?
This was the last question. I would now like to hand over the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Okay. Thank you very much. We have paid a decent dividend this year, and we hope that we will continue to pay good dividend to our investors. Thank you.