Kaveri Seed Company Ltd
NSE:KSCL
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Kaveri Seed Company Ltd
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Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Kaveri Seed Company's Q3 and 9M FY '23 Earnings Conference Call. [Operator Instructions]
Please note that this conference call will be recorded. Joining us today on this call is Mr. Mithun Chand, Executive Director.
Before we begin, I would like to mention that some of the statements made in today's call may be forward-looking in nature and may involve risks and uncertainties. For a list of such considerations, please refer to the earnings presentation.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Mithun Chand. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you. Good afternoon, and welcome, everyone, to our quarter 3 and 9 months financial year '23 earnings conference call.
We hope you had a chance to review the presentation of our results, which is also available on the website. I would touch up on the operational and financial performance of the company and then open the floor for the question-and-answer session.
We are delighted to declare good results for both quarter 3 and 9 months financial year '23. We have witnessed higher area coverage during the quarter in 2 of the large segments, rice and wheat, which has resulted in good revenue growth.
Besides this, there has been good revenue growth registered in cotton, hybrid rice, maize, vegetables and all other seed segments.
Another major achievement during the quarter and 9 months result that we were able to convert volume growth into revenue growth across the segments.
As a part of our rewarding our shareholders during the quarter, the company has successfully completed the buyback of 2,399,831 shares of INR 2 each for an aggregate amount of INR 125.37 crores.
There was a margin expansion in 9 months financial year '23. EBITDA margin was up by 378 basis points and PAT margin was up by of 409 basis points. This is a very encouraging sign, and we would be able to maintain the margins going forward.
Overall response for decreasing hybridization, increasing share of new products in each segment has good results in the current year and in the coming years.
I would now like to touch up on operational highlights for the quarter. Quarter revenues increased by 6.2%. In the non-cotton segment, hybrid rice and maize revenues increased by 117.1%, 46.5% respectively.
Hybrid Paddy KPH468 scaled up across the market, which had resulted in volume and market share gain.
Paddy higher area is reported from the states of Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh, Assam, Orissa, Karnataka and Telangana. The contribution of new products was up from 19.73% to 34.29% in the overall volumes of Maize.
Wheat has reported 2.86 lakh (sic) [ 286.50 lakh ] hectares compared to 278.25 lakh hectares, which has resulted in 8.2 lakh (sic) [ 8.25 lakh ] hectares more.
Exports continue to be strong. Presently exporting to Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Vietnam.
In quarter 3 financial '23 highlights, financial highlights. Revenue from operation was at INR 123.49 crores as compared to INR 102.08 crores in quarter 3, financial year '23, registered a growth of 20.97%.
EBITDA was at INR 43.95 crores as compared to INR 16.32 crores in quarter 3 financial year '23, increased by 160.31% (sic) [ 169.31% ].
Net profit was at INR 37.54 crores as compared to INR 9.08 crores in quarter 3 financial year '23, registered a growth of 313.24%.
EBITDA margin was up -- was at 35.59% up by 1,960 basis points. PAT margin was at 30.40%, up by 2,150 basis points.
Nine months financial year '23 highlights. Revenue was at INR 939.93 crores are against INR 860.44 crores for 9 months financial year '23, registered -- for 9 months financial year '23 registered a growth of 9.24%.
The EBITDA was at INR 303.67 crores, up by 23.69% on a year-on-year basis. PAT stood at INR 280.93 crores, up by 26.55%. EBITDA margin was at 32.31%, up by 378 basis points. PAT margin was at 29.89%, up by 409 points. Cash on goods stands at INR 403 crores.
Government commitment to support Indian research and encouraging approvals given by them for the indigenously developed new hybrid and the advanced seed varieties are going to regain changes for the coming years. This would go a long way in overall growth of the company, and we are expecting revolution and technology changes and see that in segments on both domestic and international business segments.
We would like to reiterate again that we are a strong R&D company and have been agile in bringing multiple new variants across the seed segments.
I will now open the floor for the question-and-answer session.
[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Nitin Awasthi from InCred Equities.
I would like to understand where are we on the regulation [Technical Difficulty]
I request you to speak on handset, Nitin. Sorry, your voice is not very clear.
Hello. Am I audible now?
Yes, audibility with an echo, but yes, you may try and go ahead.
Hello, is this better?
Slightly better. Yes.
Okay. So sir, just wanted to understand where are we on the regulatory front when it comes to GM mustard and HTBT cotton. If you could give us a view of where we stand, where the government stands and how probable is the commercialization of the same?
Yes. If you see in the last 2 quarters, there's the moment in the action from the government. The GAC is also moving in terms of introducing the new technologies, most probably they are likely to introduce BG-III -- BG-II RRF in the next 1 or 2 seasons.
There's a continuous meetings which are happening with both with the technology provided, government and from the private players. So there's a combination of this thing, what we see is that a lot of positivities in the last 2 quarters. We, as a company, we are expecting that the technology will come to us very soon.
Got it, sir. Also on HTBT cotton, so you're saying there is no commercial like green light and whim weather approval of AGC as of now? Because if I'm not wrong, GEAC did approved it.
No, this is still under trials, most of the trials are completed. The commercialization, the license need to be given by the government for the commercializing, then everything will fall under it. We are waiting for the approval of the GEAC, which is the authority for giving the approvals for new technology provider, not for the individual product.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Sanjeev Zarbade from DreamLadder Investment Advisors.
Okay. So I wanted to know about the cash on the balance sheet now that you have quoted in the buyback.
So the -- as on 31st December the cash is INR 403 crores. That's after the completion of the buyback. We have completed our buyback in the last week of December.
Okay. Can you throw some light on the competitive landscape? And are we in a position to pass on price increases in the future?
It's a highly competitive market. The competition is between both the domestic and the international players. We have all the international players present in India. It's not now from the last 3, 4 decades they are present.
As a company, we are competing with both domestic and international players in their respective crops, and we are able to gain market shares and we're able to realize much better than most of the companies.
And as you all know that seed is the most important part of the entire agriculture and it costs less than 5% of the total input cost in most of the times.
Spending the money for seed is not an issue with the farmer because that derives in the entire rate. So usually, farmer doesn't compromise on seed and usually we are able to pass it on this to farmer, and I think it will continue going forward. We don't see any challenges in it.
Right, sir. And whether these kind of margins that we have achieved in the current fiscal, are they achievable in the next couple of years? Or can we even maybe better from current levels?
If you see the previous last 8, 10 years, if you compare our margins, always we were sustainable, between 1 or 2 years where the margins are under full year, because we were dealing with cotton and cotton was regulated.
We had some issues in a couple of years. But if you see, always we have margin segment in between the 28% to 30%, and we are pretty confident that those margins will remain and which is maintainable.
As we go up and scale up our sales, even there's a chance of that there's a slightly improvement in the margins going forward. But for sure, this can be achievable.
Right, sir. And sir, if I look at your long-term financial performance, will be the peak revenue of INR 1,100 crores in March 2015 and we're still below that level. And during this period, even the stock price has kind of -- been a very range-bound fashion. It's almost end of the year level of what it was. So how do we see as an investor in the next 3, 4 years, whether there could be -- there is a possibility of a quantum jump from here? Are there any triggers? What kind of comfort you can share with us.
There are a couple of things to see in. One, when we have done 2014-'15, the peak revenue, the cotton contributed close to 75%, the cotton as such as a crop. Non-cotton contributed only 25%. From there, there were so many issues regarding cotton and the acreages where we peak at that particular year. Therefore in the cotton, acreages were down by more than 20% from that years, in fact, more than 25%. The cotton were at 14.5 million hectares in that year. And now it's maintained around the 10.5 million, 11 million hectares. And there were the price cut in cotton seed. And we lost market share in some crops. So it all resulted in the decline in the revenue.
But the other part of the thing what we need to see is that from 25% to we have gone to 70% plus. So, we're close to 70% in non-cotton crops.
So wherein we have improved realizations where we have see continued growth. And these are the crops which are growing in India. For example, if we take rice, rice is growing in 44 million hectares, out of which on the 5 million or 6 million hectares is hybridized. These are the crops which are in the growing phase, and we are gaining market shares in those crops, and we have very good pipeline hybrids in the crops. Not only cotton, in maize -- maize is also growing. We are growing in maize and on all segments. Earlier, we were present only in Kharif segment. Now we have moved to Rabi segment also.
And if you see both maize and cotton, maize and rice are comparable with cotton sales now.
And the other segment, even vegetables, we are growing. Sunflower, vegetables, bajra, there this, simultaneously we are growing indoor crops, but they may not be as big as this crop, because most of the Indian hybrid market is, market shares are for these 3 crops.
So what I mean to say is that we are big in those 3 crops, and we are also big in the other small segment crops. Going forward, what we see, we are in a much heavier position than what we were earlier. As a company, we were more dependent on cotton in 2014-'15. Now we are not dependent on any crop, but we are there and big in most of the crops in India.
So that, that's a very encouraging sign, and moreover, we have strengthened our R&D in the last 6, 7, 8 years. We were having R&D, but we are spending more in R&D, and we have many good pipeline hybrids, which gives us confidence to grow going forward for the next 5 to 10 years.
And the other part we need to see in between, even the technologies were not introduced in the last 5, 6 years. It's all moving in the last 6 to 8 months. So this is a very good sign for the entire industry.
Right, sir. And sir, just last question from my side. Has this change in product mix anything to do with the steady increase in working capital days over the last 7, 8 years? So like I can say it's almost 172 days in March '22, as compared to around 30 or 29 days some 7, 8 years back? Does it have anything to do with...
No, no. So this will remain based on the seasonality, based on those things we need to do. But I don't see much of a change in that. And if you see whatever cash you have generated in the last 6, 7 years, even when the stock price were not performing or we were not able to grow, but we have done 5 buybacks in the last 5 years, wherein we have extinguished close to 20% of our equity. And if you try to see the quantum, which was distributed to the shareholders in terms of the buybacks or in terms of the dividend, this is close to INR 1,100 crores - INR 1,200 crores.
Next question is from the line of Keshav Garg from Counter Cyclical PMS.
Sir, firstly, on behalf of all the shareholders, I want to thank the management and promoters for regular buybacks. And in the past 2 years, the company is doing open market share buybacks, wherein the promoters are not participating. So it is even more creditable and shows the confidence of the management and the company and the prospects. So thank you very much once again.
Sir, just wanted to understand, sir, taking from the previous caller, sir, we appreciate the reasons why after 2015, the company went in a sort of a lean patch due to the regulatory changes, which were incremental to our interest. But the question is that trailing 12 months, we are doing approximately INR 240 crores to INR 250 crores EBITDA, whereas in FY '15, we did around INR 307 crores EBITDA. So in your judgment, you think that in FY '24 company, if everything goes as per the plan, the company can exceed this all-time high EBITDA of around INR 300 crores that we did in FY '15?
No. What is the percentage, I just need to see, but the calculation what we have as of now from where we stand, we will grow in between 15% to 20% on a year-on-year basis. And that's how the calculation is. We have to do the math. But we are pretty confident that, that will continue for long.
Sir, and also, sir, in the past, not in the third quarter, but in the first 2 quarters of this financial year, sir, we have seen price erosion in the -- in our seeds. So is that behind us and the kind of revenue growth we are seeing, sir, if you could just bifurcate broadly into realization growth and volume growth?
Compared to previous year, there are a couple of things that we need to be noticed. In some crops, we have got realized well compared to previous year. In some crops we have realized well. For example, in hybrid rice, we are not able to realize well, something depreciation, even though there were volume growth.
In maize, we were able to realize more. In cotton, there was a price increase, but because of the competition in other parts, this is the lowest realization in the last 6, 7 years from us in cotton.
In spite of all those things, as we have done good sales in other products which are high profitable, we were able to increase our margins.
Going forward with the mix, what we have and with the crops where we have lost, where we were not able to realize well, we have pretty much scope of increasing more -- increasing realization in those crops. That gives us more confidence that we will be able to maintain. And in fact, it may exceed from the current levels.
Great, sir. Sir, lastly, I wanted to understand about the vegetable segment. Sir, since there are so many vegetables, sir, I don't know how big is our portfolio, how much of the vegetable crops we are covering. Sir, but the 9-month revenues of INR 35 crores sir, which are roughly like 3.5% of our quoted revenue.
So is there -- in your judgment, is there a scope that in due course, this -- the revenue from vegetables can become 10% or even beyond of the total revenue of the company?
Vegetables, one of the most important portfolio what we have. Our vegetable is growing at more than 20% of the industry level, 15% to 20% at industry level. And we have pretty much scope in that.
Even in vegetables, the majority of the market shares are by hot pepper, tomato and okra. These are the 3 crops, which contributes more than 50% of the total revenue.
So we are basically concentrating on 3 crops initially, and apart from that, we are doing some growth in cauliflower and vegetable where we are importing.
As such, vegetable, we are very bullish on vegetable, vegetable will definitely contribute to more than 10% of the revenue in the next 3 to 4 years.
Great, sir. And sir, also, apart from these segments that you have given of hybrid rice, selection rice, maize, vegetables, others. Sir, is there any other blockbuster products in the pipeline, which can -- which you think can dramatically -- I mean, step up our revenue trajectory going forward?
If you see these all, what we mentioned there, cotton, rice, maize and vegetable, this contributed to majority of the Indian market -- hybrid seed market. This contributed to close than -- more than 90% of the market share. We have very good production out of these 4.
Apart from this, we are in the sunflower, mustard, bajra wheat, which falls in the 10%. So in all the segments, we are there, but we only highlight this 4 crops, because we have the majority market shares.
Our next question is from the line of Samridh from Value Research.
Sir, I wanted to know, what is the volume growth in the non-cotton segment? If you could share the numbers for hybrid rice, selection rice and even vegetables?
Those are all there on the website in the presentation, as of now, I don't have the volume back. In all crops we have growth, it's better to -- volume growth is one of the aspects, but the other thing is also we need to also see the revenue growth. There are some crops usually, in Rabi wherein the revenue is pretty high than what we had in Kharif.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is the line of Anurag Jain, an individual investor.
Sir, my first question relates to the vegetable business. In financial year 2002 Annual Report, the company [Technical Difficulty]
Okay. My first question relates to the vegetable business. In financial year 2002 Annual Report, the company had given a guidance of revenue of INR 65 crores for the vegetable seed business. Now in the first 9 months, company has achieved around INR 35 crores of revenue in the vegetable seed business. So would you stand by the old guidance or what is the updated guidance? And how do you see the rest of the year for the different seed segments, even though I know it's basically a lean business in terms of quarters -- lean quarters.
Basically, we are pretty confident about the vegetables in the fourth quarter. Usually, the vegetables will come in the fourth quarter. So we are pretty confident, but in that sort of a figure, we need to see to what extent we can achieve it. As of now, we are in line on our targets.
And sir, my second question relates to the other income in the quarter. Given that the company has financial assets of around INR 400 crores, and probably at the start of the quarter, it would have been INR 600 crores before prior to the buyback. So on an average of INR 500 crores of assets, the other income during the quarter of almost INR 31 crores odd -- INR 30 crore plus. So if you could, is there some onetime entry there? Or what would explain the jump in the other income of INR 32 crores in the quarter?
If you see as a quarter, it looks higher. But if you see as a year-on-year basis, last time, it was like 30-odd -- INR 38 crores, INR 40 crores for the entire year.
Right.
And this time, it's like -- for the 9 months, it's like INR 47 crores or INR 48 crores. It should be another INR 5 crores, INR 10 crores more in fourth quarter, that all depends on what we release.
Basically, you all know it all depends on when we have invested and what time it's getting expired. That's how the redemption comes into the quarters. And apart from that, we had a buyback in the third quarter. So we need to redeem money for that. That also resulted in more of other income. But on a year-on-year basis, INR 40 crores to INR 50 crores, what we are getting, that's what we get at the end of the day. INR 5 or INR 10 crores plus minus, based on the date of investment and the maturity date.
Okay. And one last question, sir. During the quarter, was there any recovery from some -- there were some outstanding receivables with government corporations, which were earlier provisioned for. So was there any recovery during this quarter?
Few amounts have been recovered, but not significant, but it is in the process of recovery. But to answer to your question, we are not provided for any other extra provision for this quarter.
Okay. So in this quarter, neither there is any significant recovery or nor there is any nervousness.
But that we are pretty confident that will come.
The next question is from the line of Nitin Awasthi from InCred Equities.
Sir, going through the government documentation, one comes to know that there has been optimism given for genetically modified potato and also banana. And so -- is there any seriousness from the government for seed crops or are they going to have another experimental level?
See, that all depends. All the crops will follow. In the mean, clearance for any vegetable, for example, mustard is an edible crop. We're talking about GM mustard as well. Even GM mustard, every crop will follow it. It's not only banana, tomato is there, brinjal is there. All crops will follow.
Brinjal is on a backbone for some time now, but potatoes, bananas...
No, it's not that. There was a debate saying that, cotton is a non-edible crop. That is the reason they have not encouraged any permission for the edible crops.
Now they are talking about GM mustard, which is an edible crop. If they view any permission or license or any sort of a trialing, then all the crops will be eligible for that.
[Operator Instructions] We have the next question as a follow-up question from the line of Keshav Garg from Counter Cyclical PMS.
Sir, just wanted to understand whether any new developments have been there on the tax demand notice that we had received last quarter of INR 71 crores pertaining to FY '21. Sir, any new developments or what are we hearing from our legal team regarding that?
Last quarter itself we have mentioned that we have -- went for an appeal for it. You know report how much time it will take. Whenever the result is there, we will definitely receive from the exchanges, but at the moment we get it.
Okay, sir. And sir, also, are there any plans to get into fruit seeds?
As of now, no. We don't have any focus on that, but we are into vegetables. Whether we call it fruit or not, I don't know, because we are into watermelon.
Okay. Okay, sir. Sir, any plans to get into hydroponics?
As of now, no.
Okay, sir. Sir, and also, sir, in our last year's annual report, sir, we had borrowed some small quantum of money from department of biotechnology at 2% per annum. So is there any possibility that we can really scale up this funding from this source since it is negligible cost of 2%?
We don't require funds, because we have enough cash on the books and we have a zero debt quantum. That's the only way -- that's the only things that we are taking, because government funding and government research program is there. For that, you are having it, you are availing it. Sorry, I forgot the INR 2 crore loan, so there have been significant loan.
So that's what I'm saying that, I mean, like we don't need funds, we already have excess funds, but even if you can borrow at 2% and invest in liquid mutual funds also, still you can...
No, no, that activity we don't do. That isn't fair for that particular fund.
Sir, and also, sir, the CSR funds that we are using, sir, is there any possibility of moving those funds to increase our visibility and goodwill in our major markets?
Basically, CSR funds should not be spend for the company's branding or something. That's the one of the norms for the CSR. But we are investing in most of the education and the skill -- rural skill employment and skill development and rural infrastructure. Basically, we have it for education, we see that's coming for education.
Okay, sir. And sir, what kind of approximate CapEx program do we have over the next, let's say, 1 year?
Year-on-year, it will be between like INR 30-odd crores, INR 25 crores to INR 30-odd crores we have more majority of the investment, we've already done in the new office. It's only for the research, what we need to spend. But the year-on-year INR 25 crores to INR 30 crores, that should be sufficient. That's what we are doing for the last 6, 7, 8 years.
So this is R&D CapEx you're talking about?
Across company. Now CapEx majority goes for the processing or we are building up Hhybrid R&D Bbiotechnology plant. For that, we require CapEx. Then that will be within that INR 25 crores to INR 30 crores on year-on-year basis.
Okay. Sir, and also, sir, our subsidiaries, sir, we have not really been able to scale up the revenue from our subsidiaries which were around INR 55 crores in FY '22 after like 9 years. So going forward, sir, firstly, sir, what is the major business of the subsidiaries? And sir, also, what is the possibility of really scaling it up going forward?
If you see the subsidiaries year-on-year, they are growing. Most of the subsidiaries deal with cotton -- was dealing with cotton earlier and we have seen a dent in the cotton. But even in that scenario, subsidiaries have done well in terms of the cotton sales.
And most of the research is done in the main company, wherein we have some competitive products where we see -- Kaveri cannot promote and they are unique, that product is marketing the subsidiary products, consider the company.
So they are also gaining and we are pretty sure that, that will also grow up. And if you see on a year-on-year basis, we are growing, compared to previous year also, this year based on book. All the subsidiaries have grown compared to the previous year.
The next question is from the line of Anurag Jain, as an individual Investor.
This is more of a request than a question. In the last 5, 7 years, the company's product range has expanded significantly, but this is not reflected on the company's website. So if you could consider updating the company's website and to bring the product portfolio shown on the website in line with what you have in the market already, especially...
They're already there. But sure, anyhow I'll recheck with the new company and which we will definitely will update. Thanks for the suggestion.
The next question is from the line of Vipul Modi, as an individual Investor.
Yes. Congratulations for the good set of numbers. Sir, my question is relating to gene editing technology, which has been allowed in India. And there is no approach regarding to that. How much is the company prepared to deal with it? Is it that the company is looking for collaboration with gene editing technology, retain shareholder companies? Or is it like the company has applied for gene editing or something? Will it pose threat to the hybrids, since the company has already into?
We are open for the tie up with the companies. Now the most of the new technologies, the gene editing technology is coming now. It's that, that is the one which is linked with it. We are already -- we are already seeing exploring some options in that, but it will take some time. But we are open for it.
Okay. Does it pose a threat to hybrid portfolio, existing portfolio? Is it better? Does it compete of our portfolio?
See, when the new technology comes in, definitely, most of the companies upgrade to those technologies. Usually, the companies adapt those technologies, which are better for the better, because that's what we do in hybridization. Even if you take any hybrids, if there's any good jump or if any new issue turns up, definitely we will reach for that one. So definitely, most of the companies will upgrade to those technologies. And I don't think that's a [indiscernible].
The only thing that might be replaced with the new technologies. For example, if you take cotton, when the genetically modified crops came in, then most of the hybrid move into genetically modified hybrids.
That's very well understood. Okay, one more thing I want to ask. What are some special like what is the special, let's what you call, effort given for exports -- to increase our exports?
We are very -- again, on export, we are very much believe on exports, we are exporting to neighboring countries, Southeast and even the African countries. So we see a lot of opportunity there. And some of the products are where we're very much accepted there. And going forward, definitely, you see a good revenue growth in exports also.
But it will take time as we need to test our products in other countries, the registration itself takes 3 years to 5 years in most of the companies. We are already in the process of registering it in some companies, and we are marketing to some other companies there. Okay. But definitely increase in the revenue.
[Operator Instructions] Ladies and gentlemen, that would be our last question for today. Thank you for joining the conference call. For any further queries or meetings, please be in touch with Rama Naidu from Intellect PR on his mobile number 992 020 9623. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.
Thank you.
Thank you.