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ITD Cementation India Ltd
Earnings Call Analysis
Summary
Q2-2024
The company has experienced a stellar quarter with operating income growing by 56% year-on-year to INR 1,610 crores. EBITDA saw a 78% increase, and profit after tax surged by 168%. Revenue to date stands at INR 3,500 crores, with expectations to exceed INR 7,000 crores after Q3 and Q4. Looking forward, a 20%-25% growth in top line is forecasted for the next year. Working capital is under 90 days, and while improvements are possible, significant reduction beyond this is unlikely. Furthermore, the financial cost for bank guarantees remains competitive at approximately 0.8%-1%.
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Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. I'm Edwin, moderator for the conference call. Welcome to ITD Cementation India Limited Q2 FY '24 Results Conference Call, hosted by ICICI Securities Limited. [Operator Instructions] Please note, this conference is recorded.
I would now like to hand over the floor to Mr. Mohit Kumar from ICCI Securities. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Yes. Thank you, Edwin. Good evening. On behalf of ICICI Securities, I welcome you all to the Q2 FY '24 Earnings Call of ITD Cementation India Limited.
Today, we are pleased to host the senior management of the company, which is represented by Mr. Jayanta Basu, Managing Director; Mr. Prasad Patwardhan, CFO of the company.
Without much delay, I'll now hand over the call to Mr. Prasad for his opening remarks, which will be followed by Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Mohit. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us on this Q2 FY '24 earnings call.
We declared our results for the second quarter yesterday, and I'm sure you have had a chance to go through our numbers.
Before we begin the discussion, I would like to mention that during the course of this call, there could be some forward-looking statements that will be made. These are subject to risks, and the actual results are likely to differ materially from these statements. I would like to keep -- request you to keep this in mind.
I will start with the financial performance of the company, and then hand over to Mr. Basu for his views on the operational performance, and then we'll take your calls.
We have had -- we have reported a robust performance in this quarter, with an operating income of INR 1,610 crores as against INR 1,035 crores, a growth of 56% on a Y-o-Y basis. EBITDA at INR 172 crores has grown by about 78% on a year-on-year basis. And profit after tax at INR 54 crores as against INR 20 crores, with an increase of about 168%.
Our balance sheet continues to be leverage much less, and our debt equity ratio -- net debt to equity is about 0.34x. Our order book stands at about 22,000 -- a little over INR 22,000 crores as of Q2 end. And the new orders that we have secured during the quarter are worth about INR 4,600 crores.
That is all from my side. To start with, I'll now hand over to Mr. Basu for his opening comments.
Thank you, Prasad. Good evening, all of you for joining this con call. Happy to say that we have seen another good quarter in terms of the profitability and even the revenue as well. Normally, this was monsoon quarter, so revenue is a little less than the first quarter, but still much better than last year.
The numbers are all available with you, so I don't have to talk much on that. But if we -- if you like, I may mention that EBITDA is around INR 125 crores on conso, a revenue of INR 1,616 crores, which was up more than 10%. PAT INR 54 crores, 3.3% of the revenue.
And in the last 6 months, that is Q1 and Q2, we have achieved around INR 3,500 crores of revenue. You have to consider that Q2 was due to monsoon. The revenue was a little less. So normally, Q3 and Q4 we can expect better revenue than Q1 and Q2. Last year, our Q1, Q2 revenue was INR 2,000 crores, and Q2, Q3 was INR 3,000 crores. That's for information.
Our cash position also in good. Collection and outflow, we are able to manage properly. You may like to know progress [indiscernible] job, I'll share with you like underground to metros. We have been [indiscernible] metro [indiscernible] line running job, Kolkata and Mumbai is almost [indiscernible] completion. Governmental substantial progress has been done. Around 80% of the job has been completed. [indiscernible] around 20%-plus progress we have done.
A good thing about CNI is that in one of the package, as you know, we have got two packages there. Already we have logged our paddle boarding machine, and the tunnel boring has already started from the [indiscernible] site.
[indiscernible] expressway from the reception we have so far achieved around INR 900 crore revenue during last months 7, 8 months. Monsoon has affected last quarter. So around [ 82.5% ] revenue progress we have achieved in a very small time.
Afterwards is the main item there, almost 30% of the artwork has been completed. We have our plan. We're doing pretty well as part of plan progress. I also like to mention here that one bridge, [indiscernible], have completed all the foundation and infrastructure. So this has gone very well.
In [indiscernible], except the finishing item, which is commissioning of the crane, which has to come from overseas. All the filler has been completed, a remarkable project in terms of the challenge and volume.
Colombo overseas job is going pretty well. You must have seen some news yesterday -- a day from yesterday about the [indiscernible] and [indiscernible] we are getting from the financial institutions. We are very much and progress is as per the schedule.
[indiscernible] break water, another one main job, very challenging. And happy to say that the job is almost getting completed [indiscernible]. So that there are a few other jobs like in building. We have job for [indiscernible]. Today, almost completed and daily customer measure.
After 2 years, the job has started a few months back. So now it has picked up. We have started also the Army headquarter at Delhi. We have achieved the first milestone as per the schedule and few other building jobs also going okay.
So with this, as you can see that we have got INR 22,000 crores of work we have, and Maritime has again come to the top around 35.3% of the CR of the world. We have got two jobs in pipeline. One of the jobs we have [indiscernible], that is for the [indiscernible] facility for the subsea pier we are discussing with the customer. And we have also [indiscernible] job as well.
So with this, I'll stop and I request to have questions. We are ready to answer whatever you ask. Thank you.
[Operator Instructions] The first question comes from Nikhil Abhyankar from ICICI Securities.
You reported very strong robust execution growth in the electronic cell. And also the margins are already above 9% in H1. So will you be revising your guidance for FY '23?
Based on which that you're talking?
Full year.
Revenue, EBITDA and order inflow, sir.
I think we'll maintain the same, which is around INR 7,000 crores plus in the top line. And we hope that EBITDA will be just 10% above [indiscernible].
And sir -- order inflow, sir?
Order so far, we have secured close to INR 5,000 crores, INR 4,800 crores. And as we said that two jobs, is [indiscernible], and there are some prospects. So hopefully, end of the year, it will be around INR 8,000 crores, INR 8,000 crores plus total order inflow in this year.
Okay. Sir, what is the quantum of [indiscernible] order that you're sitting in?
Can you come again?
What is the value of the [indiscernible] order?
H1 order is about INR 650 crores.
INR 650 crores. Sir, now moving to order inflow in H2. So where are the opportunities? What are the opportunities that you are looking at? And [indiscernible]?
The opportunity we have few -- very job in Bangladesh. The same [indiscernible] now under preparation and hopefully, by end of this year, we'll be able to [indiscernible] our bid.
Few marine job already have quoted for DSW and [indiscernible] as well. We are pursuing some job in Guiso for a big new port being developed. We have also some [indiscernible] job pursuing at [indiscernible]. And that are just from our service terms in [indiscernible]. So a mix of [indiscernible] segment, like marine, building and the metros. Altogether, I think around INR 13,000 or INR 14,000 crores of job is under the pipeline now.
Okay. And sir, just a final question. On storage, you had getting a lot of traction. A lot of companies are announcing their plans. So are we [indiscernible] developing capabilities in this segment?
Actually, we are in this segment. We have done a few very challenging jobs in this segment before. In Mehalla, we have done. And we are also pursuing a similar kind of job now. So yes, we are there, very much there.
Sir, are we in discussion with any of the IPPs or developers?
Yes, we are discussing. Yes.
Next question comes from Bajrang Bafna from Sunidhi Securities.
Congratulations for a good set of numbers. So my first question pertains to the average execution of the existing order book. We are sitting on, let's say, INR 22,000 crores of order book. And we have visibility of, let's say, another INR 3,000 to INR 4,000 crores of flow during this financial year, in the second half.
So considering what could be the average execution cycle? And what sort of growth on this base of INR 7,000 crores, execution this year, we can expect for, let's say, FY '25 or '26? Some strategy of the guidance or the [indiscernible] of the management will be really appreciated.
And my second question is the visibility on the -- like you are looking more and more towards -- slightly the project where margins are high and the competition is low, like marine and some complex jobs there, which is not the business of other companies where you can [indiscernible] better margins.
So the trajectory maybe next 2 to 3 years, [indiscernible] where we can move from, let's say, this 10% to -- it was 12%, 13%. Is it something which the management is thinking from next 2, 3 year's perspective? So that's the second question from my side. And some sense on the improvement in the working capital cycle, that probably how we are looking at and that may be appreciated. That's all from my side.
Okay. I think anything in the one question. But -- so I'll try to address one by one. This year, the revenue so far, we have done around INR 3,500 crores. So quarter 3 and quarter 4 will be definitely a little bit more than that. So hopefully INR 7,000 crore plus. I mean, we'll definitely achieve.
Going forward to next year, we can think about around 20%, 25% growth in top line. Because work in hand, what we have now, they are fairly big. Like [indiscernible], you know, INR 5,000 crore project for Navy versus INR 3,200 crores development put together. I mean Metro 4,000. So did good job. So nevertheless, we should be able to achieve around 25% more than this year.
Regarding further from next year onwards, our focus will remain for the bigger jobs. The idea is to less number of projects, but these projects should be bigger, bigger in the send, 1,000, 2,000 in that range. And that gives us a lot of leverage to work properly and efficiently that we have seen.
That is why we are also targeting job, which has got turnkey sort of things, like electromechanical, crane and many other things, not only civil. And our focus also will remain on the green energy because a lot of emphasis is given by the government and some private sectors, the green energy, on the hydrogen.
So big plants are being set up by the local entrepreneurs. They are focusing on that. We're also focusing neighboring countries for the marine work at least, and there are some inquiries, which are quite encouraging. So that is what I can say about the execution for next 1 or 2 years.
Regarding working capital, I would like to -- Prasad, if you can address that.
Yes. In fact, there is a lot of efficiency that we are reporting on our working capital cycle as well. Net working capital is today less than 90 days. While there are obviously opportunities to improve the working capital cycle, I don't think there is a significant improvement possible beyond this level. So 80, 85 days I think is a very robust and healthy net working capital cycle, but our endeavor will need to, wherever possible to improve the cycle further.
Okay. And just one change that we want to get now. Most of the players who are there in the industry, in the infrastructure side, they are struggling to get [indiscernible] at the right costing. Like we were even gearing that -- a lot of in 2% or maybe 2.5% kind of the staging cost for getting those lines on the banking channel. So what is the interest rate that we are paying on BT currently? And some sense on that because it is a major portion of our interest cost as well. So some guidance on that will be really helpful.
The commission that we paid generally varies from 0.7%, 0.8%, and it depends on the value intake of the [indiscernible]. So especially for guarantees that we provide in foreign countries, there is more than one bank involved. The bank and commission would think to be a bit higher, but it's in the range of about, say, 1% or they're about 0.8% to 1% thereabouts.
Okay. And this is a very competitive rate because of it, whenever we are meeting with a lot of companies, they're all stacking for trading the big limits at the right costing. So this is really changing actually really happening to know that we are getting most competitive rate in the industry at least when this space is concerned.
Next question comes from Pratik Kothari from Unique.
Sir, congratulations on a very strong execution. Sir, my first question, I mean, we're currently already at about INR 7,000 crores, INR 7,500 crores. [indiscernible] at INR 10,000 crores very soon. So if can talk about internally, what are we doing? Or how are we preparing to execute and scale? This is something which we have not obviously done in the past. How is our preparation going internally?
Well, we are seriously concerned about our internal capability. If I can decide -- address one by one, first of all, technical capability, that's not an issue because we have got experienced people. And through experience, we are quite knowledgable in the business what we are.
We have built up some new team for the overseas. So what we are doing now, we have already worked in Myanmar. We are working in Colombo. We are working in Bangladesh. So there is a core team trying to invest some more team with the existing core team. So by another 6, 7 months' time, then we can train.
The most important part is the support system because we have to support the execution from logistic, from finance and from -- whatever you say. So those areas we are strengthening and -- so the plant vicinity is not a problem because nowadays, you get the required plant vicinity. Either you can buy [indiscernible], hire it. Those things are pretty available.
So while [indiscernible] stuck up mostly the bottom line -- bottom for the labor force, watchman. And that is a common problem for all the companies in our industry. So we are trying to migrate from most of the manual work to the mechanical work. That is one area.
And second area how to educate this labor force. How to keep them, how to continue them in our company, the sort of initiative we should take. We are really focusing on that. So these are some of the area [indiscernible] things we are doing to increase our capability.
Correct. Fair enough. And sir, I think we had planned for about INR 150 crores, INR 200 crores of CapEx this year. And I think they have already done INR 240 crores in CapEx. So any change in plans? Are you accelerating something for the execution coming up here? If you can highlight, sir.
Yes. I think the CapEx was more this last year or so because of -- we have to invest a lot in the [indiscernible] cutter and travel boding machine for the metros are secured. But going forward, we don't expect that much of CapEx will be involved because whatever we have already, that can be used for the next project. And for the marine, we already have our adequate plot evolutionary. There will be some, but not to this extent.
Okay. Sir, a large part of what ever investments we have to make for next -- taking into account next 18 months, 24 months, we have already returned that, and it will only be minor going forward?
Exactly. That is the -- [indiscernible] Bangladesh project, which is already -- we have secured and we will be -- it is not CapEx basically. You have to rent some big machinery for a duration of 6 to 7 months' time. So otherwise, a large amount of CapEx that we have invested already that we don't expect much investment now.
Fair enough. And sir, one of the previous [indiscernible], you did mention that now our focus would be to do less number of jobs, but do very large INR 1,000 crores plus. Is it also fair to assume that the competition in that segment is lower than usually what we see at the lower order, INR 200 crores, INR 300 crores, INR 500 crores order?
Exactly. If you see -- now if you have a report tender, and the value is INR 300 crores, INR 400 crores, you will find 10 participants there. In the same, we have four terminal buildings. It cost INR 2,000 crores. It will hardly boil down to 3 or 4 participants.
In that way also, good for us that we are able to get qualified ourselves because of whatever work we have done. So definitely, the [indiscernible] is big, the competition in place.
All right. And so, my last question to Prasad Patwardhan. If you can highlight any further provisions, which we have made this quarter? And also in a stand-alone cash flow, we see this INR 9 crores of loss from [indiscernible] corporate and NTT. If you can highlight what is that regarding?
No, we haven't done. This is -- what we would have done in a normal expected credit loss provision. There is nothing really any additional provisions that we have carried out in this quarter.
Correct. And the loss from in corporate identity?
No, that is something that we had done in Q1. I don't think we have done anything in Q2. So maybe I'm looking at the 6-month balance sheet on the cash flow, where it will get affected because it is for the half year and not for this quarter, in particular.
Next question comes from Siddharth Shah from MK Ventures.
Congrats on great set of numbers. Sir, in your opening remarks, you mentioned that second half is normally much higher than the first half. For example, last year, you were INR 3,000 crores in the second half and INR 2,000 crores in the first half, so 60-40 type of ratio.
So sir, how does it -- but the current year guidance is still around INR 7,000 crores. And you've already done INR 3,500 crores in first half. And also all the projects are taking off well. So just to understand, is this quite conservative? Or this is what is practically possible or what is? So some comments on this would be very helpful, sir.
Yes, I think you have rightly picked up the comments that I made. That was -- I want to emphasize that whatever guidelines we have given, that -- we definitely will achieve that. We definitely try to achieve more. But sometimes those numbers also it varies year by year. It will not be same this year. Last year, 50% more and maybe it's a little bit less on that. So what I'm trying to emphasize, the INR 7,000 crores plus will be definitely will be achieved here, sir.
Sure, sir. That's helpful. And the second question is a similar question to one of the previous participants, that going forward -- no, all this provisioning of Bangalore project and all has been taken.
So from next year onwards, what kind of margins are you guys internally working on? Is it 12%, 13% margin possible in the next 2, 3 years? Or we should kind of expect any [indiscernible] of margin going forward?
Yes. I feel so far, till a few quarters back, our margin used to be around 8% to 9%, 8.5% EBITDA. We have come to close to 10% now. So beyond that, if you have to do -- when you have to really get the job in a better price. So we have to be in the competition also.
So yes, 10% plus and how much you can go beyond that as we see based on the nature of job, at what price are getting the job, or the competition makes [indiscernible].
Sure, sir. And sir, last question is on the debt part. If you can just highlight what is the net debt of the company now [indiscernible]?
Net debt of the company end of September ended about INR 460 crores.
Next question comes from Laja Nervana from Laja Professional Investor.
Sir, I wanted to understand, because general elections will be there in Q1 of next financial year. So just like in the road sector, there is usually some slowdown. In our line of business, do you anticipate any kind of execution slowdown?
Not really. I think -- because of election, perhaps the election, there will be a lot of pressure to do more work. So because of election, I don't see that, that will effect our work.
New tenders or new projects, which come up for tendering. Inventory orders that we have already received or have been awarded to us. We don't expect any slowdown in the execution of the projects that we have on hand.
Okay. And for orders also, sir, do you anticipate a slowdown? And if you do, then do you expect it to be a transient phenomenon, which will take it and in some quarter 2, quarter 3 onwards next year?
Generally, there may be a little bit of -- I'm not saying there definitely will be a slowdown, but there could be a little bit of slowdown or postponement in some of the tenders, which come up for bidding. But that will obviously be a temporary phenomenon. On the election or through, I mean, the focus on infrastructure would remain, and I don't think it is going to impact the industry in the long run.
Okay. All right, sir. And in [indiscernible] recently, there was a cloud burse [indiscernible] of flood, which caused a lot of destruction. So we are doing those tunnel project in Rangpo. So was there any impact on our project? Is there going to be any impact in future?
That should -- there was no damage to -- for any structure or any sort of -- I mean problem we face. The only thing that, a few days, the work has stopped, and that too only 4 days. So we are able to manage. I don't see that there is an issue on that.
Okay. That is very nice to hear, sir. And on cash flows and debt, so we have done a lot of CapEx, as was already discussed. Now I noticed that our operating cash flows are quite healthy in half year. So I think going forward also, we can hope to generate this kind of operating cash flow. So are we planning to become net debt-free anytime soon?
No, I don't think we'll be able to be debt-free at least in this financial year or the next financial year. This business is working capital intensive to some extent. So while we are trying to manage or ensure that the debt doesn't go out of hand in our balance sheet, I really don't see us becoming net debt-free in this financial year or the next financial year.
Okay, sir. In that case, can you help me understand the interest rate trajectory. So I think you have short-term working capital loans, long-term loans and the non-fund-based limits that you take. So can you guide the interest rate that we should assume for this so that we can sort of estimate the interest cost that will come?
Well, I can indicate the interest rates that are being charged to us presently. Going forward, we'll have seen, it depends on many factors. So for CapEx is debt interested you would vary typically from 9%, 9.5% to maybe 10.5% or 11%. [indiscernible] the interest rates are still lower, then maybe higher single digits.
Okay. And for our BG limit, you said maximum 1%.
It's around 1%. It typically depends on the bank, which we are delineate tenor of the bank, the location where it is issued. So there are multiple factors which influence the charges that we paid. But it's around 1%, maybe sometimes a little higher than 1%, or many times lower than 1%.
Okay. All right. And final question from my side. The CapEx side, we have back INR 238 crores. Can you help me understand towards what this CapEx has gone towards? Because I'm not very familiar with the kind of machinery that you're using.
Sir, it will be very helpful if you can outline like what are the kind of machines where -- we have bought with this? And why a buy decision versus a leasing decision? So some color on that, so that we understand better.
Look, Chennai Metro, we had to do a construction called [indiscernible] Wall, which is vertical wall below the ground, which goes around 30, 35 meters. And in most of the cases, you have to do the wall through soil.
So -- but typically, in Chennai Metro, it is rock. In rock, whenever you try to do such work, we require a special machine which is called hinge cutter, hardly we had in India before. So we had to have nine change cutter mobilized. And to answer your second question, out of that four you have buy -- bought, then five is buyback or rental sort of things.
So what is the cost, sir, for each machine?
It will be around INR 40 crores plus minus each machine. And supporting the changed color, there are some other small equipment. And we bought few [indiscernible] as well. And another one is the important thing is the TV tunnel boring machine. We bought one tunnel boring machine for the CI metro. So total boring machine, hedge cutter and few piling rigs. These are the equipment we have purchased out of the 10 orders.
That's helpful. Sir, final two questions, a follow-up on the third 4x cutter. What is the -- INR 40 crore [indiscernible], right?
Yes.
Yes.
Around that.
And the tunnel boring machine would be how much?
This tunnel boring machine, there is a cost of procurement and there's some refurbishment costs as well. So this tunnel boring machine could go between INR 30 crores and INR 40 crores.
Okay. Okay. And we hope to utilize this machine across the multiple projects we are working on, tunnel projects, plus metro projects, I think. So utilization you think will not be a challenge for both the trench cutters and the TBM machine that we have bought?
Yes, yes, we have to utilize them. And there are visibility that is what in the business. I mean, we have to utilize them.
Right. Sir, many congratulations on this quarter. It was really happening to 3, 10% EBITDA and really wishing that in the coming years, you can cross INR 10,000 crores with much higher EBITDA margins, and keep doing the excellent high-level technical work that the entire team is doing.
.
The next question comes from Aman Sony, an individual investor.
I'm joining the con call for the first time. So I just wanted to understand -- I have a couple of questions. I'll go one by one. My first question was on the margin profile.
I understand that even the company does different orders from human [indiscernible] to marine and all other things. So which kind of orders provide a better margin? And if you can quantify that, that will be good.
Well, typically, we have -- our experience has been that underground network and marine projects give us better margins. There would typically -- each project comes with its own set of complexities. So the margin profile will differ from project to project, but we would -- our margins are certainly higher on these two segments as compared to the segment that we [indiscernible].
Okay. All right. And one more thing, I read in your previous con call that you mentioned something about INR 29 crores provisioning that you did. So what was it during the current quarter?
Nothing. There was no provision. This was in Q1 for one of the limited metro projects. We have taken a hit of INR 29 crores in Q1. There is nothing in Q2.
Okay. And secondly, my last question was on the tax rate. So in the past couple of quarters, I see the tax rate hovers around -- sometimes 40, 45. So what should be the number going forward? What can we expect?
On a standalone basis, the tax rate is around 25%. So there's no change in that. But the results that we declared as a mix of our standard profit as well as the profit that we record on some of the joint venture projects that we have. And that is why there is a change in the tax rate. But going forward, I think it should be in the range of 25%, 26%.
25, 26. Okay. And one last thing, I read in the opening remarks, you're detailing out different projects and the completion payers. So I can see that some other companies in their investor presentation usually give -- what the percentage, which is completed, along with the project name. So would it be possible to share that in the coming quarters in the investor presentation?
Well, there are about 50 to 60 projects that we are executing. But that's a good [indiscernible] that we have received from you. We'll see how we can factor that in the presentation going forward.
Yes, I understand. Basically, it will be great if initially you can just start off with maybe 50%, 60% of whatever your top 1 as well. That would be very much helpful.
Next question comes from Sameer Deshpande from Fairdeal Investments.
Congratulations for the excellent set of results we have produced over the last 6 months. Actually I heard the net debt is around INR 460 crores or INR 260 crores.
460.
460.
Yes.
Because if -- in the balance sheet, if I go for the consolidated balance sheet, the loans -- gross loans are around INR 750 crores. And cash and balances totally around INR 500 crores. So it comes to INR 250 crores net debt.
No, the gross debt number is correct. We have taken some of the deposits and [indiscernible] against some of the guarantees that have been issued. So if you -- we have reconsidered unencumbered deposits were working on the net debt. And according to that, the net debt works out to about INR 460 crores.
So it is quite comfortable concerning the industry situation, and we have managed our working capital also very well. As you mentioned, less than 90 days is quite commendable. And now you mentioned getting this maritime projects, and these underground metros are the most profitable part of our total business. So in that, maritime would contribute, I think, more than 50% of our order book or 40%?
It is now close to 40%.
Which is around INR 7,800 crores out of INR 22,000 crores? Okay. Quick good business in terms -- picking up well [indiscernible]. We hope the execution also will be good in the second half.
Yes, that is what is expected.
Next question comes from Kaushik Poddar from KB Capital Markets.
See with your turnover going up sharply, say, 20%, 25%, do you see the margin also going up -- EBITDA margin?
EBITDA margin, yes, you are right because there are some fixed cost, which doesn't get proportionately change. So chronically, it should go up.
And to what level do you see in '25? See, right now, I think you are around 10.6% or 10.7%. So can we think of, say, 11%, 11.5% this year and next year?
Yes. Actually, the margin also is a function of competition. You have to seek some job at a lower margin. So that is also a way. So yes, 10% plus. Let's see how best we can do next year.
Okay. And do you see with the inflation -- sorry, with the election being a few months away or something, there will be a kind of freeze in new orders?
Yes. Expected during the -- around election time, there will be -- but [indiscernible], we are already secured. Whatever we are expecting for the [indiscernible]. Whatever you have given the guidelines will be affected.
Okay. So even with the election being say, 4, 5 months away, you still see the 20%, 25% growth for next year. I mean that should not be a problem because of the orders are at hand. That's what you're saying?
Yes. Yes. Right.
[Operator Instructions] Next question comes from Kunal [indiscernible] from -- an individual investor.
Congratulations, sir, for the fantastic results. And -- to get the guidance also for the balance of the 6 months. I wanted to ask about the [indiscernible] awards that we have in our [indiscernible]. We expect any cash flow from any of these awards in this financial year?
Yes, Kunal, you are most welcome. Thank you for joining this con call. Yes, we have bought a few arbitration award. One is from [indiscernible] 4, which was a joint [indiscernible] company.
The discussions are going on. So we expect that some results will come out soon. I mean when I say soon, maybe 3, 4 months' time. And another one about we have from the [indiscernible] authority, which is around INR 40-odd crores.
So now the authority has gone to the court, challenging the award. But normally, the arbitration award, from there, you can expect that. The court order will soon be favorable to us. So these are the two arbitration awards we have now seeing.
So what will be the value of the cash flow that you're expecting?
From the arbitration?
Yes, from the arbitration.
If we for the lot -- it is quite defined because it is around INR 40 crores. But for [indiscernible], the discussions are going on. So we really want to see that how well it goes out. So we don't want to comment on that, but maybe around INR 40 crores would look at.
Right, sir. Sir, if you could give me a breakup of the revenue that you expect from [indiscernible] projects for the next 6 months?
[indiscernible] expressway, there should be around INR 150 crores to INR 200 crores per month. Typically metro jobs, INR 40 crores to INR 50 crores per month for each metro jobs. That is our strategy [indiscernible] detail.
Sir, for the marine projects?
For the marine projects, it's a little bit early because we are still in the planning stage. It depends upon where you do the dredging. Because we can do the dredging in the monsoon, before the next monsoon starts, or we go to dredging after the next monsoon starts. So the whole thing will depend up on the dredging progress. At this moment, I don't have the right number to share with you.
Right, sir. So for the expressway, you said INR 900 crores revenue was booked in this quarter. Am I correct, sir?
No, you are wrong. So far, we have done INR 900 crores from inception.
Okay. Okay. This is the total execution. Okay. Understood. So one more thing I wanted to understand, we are giving [indiscernible]. And we are also giving dividends. Can the company consider a share buyback, which is more tax efficient for retail and small investors?
I don't have the answer for that today. This is our discussion strategy. So I won't be able to comment on that right now.
Last question. Sir, any bill discounting for vendors or your contractors or financing, like LNG plants? Have we tied up with any NBFC? Or is there anything in pipeline that we would -- we're looking to do?
We have [indiscernible] banks.
Next is a follow-up question from Bajrang Bafna from Sunidhi Securities.
Sir, on the Bangalore Metro, is there anything left? Because I think most of the provisions has already been done. Any revenue, which is yet to be booked or any more provisions required? And we -- can we expect some sort of -- the total loss that we booked over last 1- to 2-year kind of time frame is upwards of INR 150 crores, if I recollect it right. So any possibility of getting this money back to some settlement of some arbitration? So some guidance on that will be really helpful, sir.
Well, Bangalore metro physically all work completed. There are three contracts there. Out of 3 -- out of four contracts, I'm sorry. Out of the three contracts already taken over by the client finally certified -- or certification is under progress. The fourth one also completed, and taking over also is happening.
So whatever left out, revenue would be hardly few crores, which will come through the final bill. So we -- and the provisioning part is almost over. I don't expect there'll be anything further required. That was clarified in the last con call as well.
And we have got a few claims in the additional work done. We have submitted our bill. So those are under process, and some will go for arbitration. And as you know, that arbitration process takes time. We will not be able to comment on the time line, but definitely, we are pursuing to [indiscernible] in our ex items.
So what is the total cost over that we have booked so far in the Bangalore project? The total amount till date?
Total amount not readily available. Maybe we can reconnect offline and discuss this [indiscernible].
Next question comes from [indiscernible] Mehta from [indiscernible] Wealth.
In terms of CapEx for the first half, I believe what I heard is INR 238 crores has been so far incurred. So any guidance for next -- I mean, for H2? Like who would like to be for CapEx, what can we expect?
It's really very less. I mean, first 2 quarters, we had to invest for many things which I have discussed that now. But going forward, it will be quite less. I don't have the exact number, but it will be much less.
Next is a follow-up question from Sameer Deshpande from Fairdeal Investments.
I wanted to know what is the amount of advance received against contracts in our current liabilities?
Well, as of the quarter end, the total amount of advances outstanding is about INR 1,300 crores, INR 1,400 crores.
INR 1,300 crores, INR 1,400 crores. Because normally, we must be receiving the advances for the new -- when new contracts we are getting, you be receiving certain portion as advance [indiscernible] So it was, say, INR 1,300 crores, INR 1,400 crores. What was the amount last year? Any idea on that?
No, I wouldn't have the last year since available [indiscernible] available right now. Okay.
Because our [indiscernible] working progress as of September is around INR 1,540 crores, which is up now almost 50%. [indiscernible] on the 31st March figure last year. So this is also -- because of the new contracts issued, et cetera significant way, this figure also must be better. That will help us in questioning our working capital requirements.
You're right. And the numbers will be available in our annual report, and our results are available publicly. You will be able to look at it. The working progress is higher because we need to -- in the initial periods of any project, [indiscernible] is awarded.
There is a lot of expenditure that we need to incur on mobilizing plant equipment, materials, et cetera. And only in the bidding cycle starts, that we see modernization in the working progress. And so I think the growth in the working progress number is in line with the growth in our order book and our revenue.
Next is a follow-up question from Pratik Kothari from Unique PMS.
Sir, one comment from you on [indiscernible] read about Mr. Jindal's comment on the kind of capacity which they expect India should build similarly from [indiscernible]. Recently this development, the U.S. government funding, one of your projects for the [indiscernible]. Just your comment -- I mean what kind of pipeline or run rate do you see for the next few years on the port side?
Yes. Port side, there are a lot of capacity deficit we have in our country. Either the container cargo or the bulk cargo, whereas the bulk cargo, it is, iron ore, coal, et cetera, et cetera.
So there will be a lot of new capital has to be there the coming years. And you can see that it's getting reflected in the [indiscernible] one by one [indiscernible] promoters like the [indiscernible], [indiscernible] and many of them are focusing Odisha to building up the port there.
So -- and at the same time, defense also coming up with a lot of marine jobs in and around the coast line and [indiscernible] and many other places. So there is a lot of marine job prospect in India going forward.
There are no further questions. Now I hand over the floor to the management for closing comments.
Thank you very much for joining us on this Q2 FY '24 earnings call. On behalf of the company, Mr. Basu and myself, I would like to wish each and every one of you a very happy Diwali and prosperous New Year. I look forward to interacting with you again after our Q3 results. Thank you.
Thank you, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes your conference for today. Thank you for your participation and for using Door Sabha's conference call service. You may disconnect your lines now. Thank you, and have a pleasant day.