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DB Corp Ltd
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Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the D.B. Corp. Limited Q1 FY '23 Earnings Conference Call. [Operator Instructions] We have with us today the senior management team of D.B. Corp. Limited. Mr. Pawan Agarwal, Deputy Managing Director; Mr. Girish Agarwaal, Non-Executive Director; Mr. P.G. Mishra, Group CFO; and Mr. Mushtaq Ali, Vice President; Mr. Lalit Jain, AVP; and Mr. Prasoon Kumar Pandey, Head, Investor and Media Relations, who will represent D.B. Corp. Limited on the call.
The management will be sharing the key operating and financial highlights for the quarter ended June 30, 2022, followed by a question-and-answer session. Please note that some of the statements made in today's discussion may be forward-looking in nature and may involve risks and uncertainties. Documents relating to the company's financial performance have already been e-mailed to you and are available on the website of the stock exchanges and the company's Investors' section. Just you have been able to go through the same. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Pawan Agarwal. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you very much, and a very good evening to everyone, and thank you for joining the Q1 FY 2023 D.B. Corp. Earnings Conference Call. We'll begin the call by highlighting the key financial performance for the quarter ended June 30, 2022, followed by key operational updates. We are pleased to report that despite inflationary pressures and challenging [indiscernible] in the domestic and global markets, we have delivered strong results in this quarter.
We witnessed good growth in both circulation and advertising. We have commenced this new financial year on an optimistic note. In Q1 FY 2023, advertising revenue grew by 96.6% to INR 3,369 million versus INR 1,713 million of Q1 FY 2022. Circulation revenue recorded a growth of 4.5% to INR 1,156 million against INR 1,106 million of previous year.
EBITDA stands at INR 738 million versus INR 51 million of previous year despite high news print prices and a continued investment in the digital business. This was possible in large measure due to stringent and long-term cost control measures that continue to serve us well. Print business EBITDA margin stood at 20%. PAT for the quarter stood at INR 310 million versus a net loss of INR 223 million in Q1 FY 2022.
Moving on to our digital business. The company has been steadily growing its loyal daily active user base across all its apps, an increase of over 8x from 2 million in January 2020 to about 17 million in May 2022, can be attributed to focus on ensuring high-quality content with a bespoke and highly personalized product experience.
This, we believe, has helped properly Dainik Bhaskar grow in becoming the dominant digital leader with #1 Hindi and Gujarati news app players. With the dominance already established in the print format and now in the digital format, we are undoubtedly the #1 digital Indian language newspaper in the company -- in the country.
Coming to the radio division. In Q1 FY 2023, revenue grew by 105.8% Y-o-Y to INR 320 million versus INR 156 million last year. EBITDA grew exponential INR 94.2 million versus a loss of INR 2.6 million. EBITDA margin for the quarter stood at 29.4%. The MY FM team continues to connect with the audience and augment in listener engagement activities through innovative content creation.
This has also helped us get better ad rates, and we are hopeful of further improving this in the forthcoming quarters. With this, I would now request Mr. Girish Agarwaal to update us on the operations. Over to you.
Good evening, and thank you, everybody. Thank you, Pawan. We hope and wish you and your family members are healthy and safe. As Pawan stated, we have commenced the financial year on a stronger note with strong Q-on-Q and Y-o-Y performance across all segments. I think it's more important to note the Q-on-Q rather than Y-o-Y for simple reason because last year, the first quarter was a COVID hit quarter.
So the numbers look very highly growth-centric. But to be very honest, we need to compare it Q-on-Q. Also, we should compare ourselves with the '19/'20 quarter rather than last year. We are hopeful that at this pace, print sector should be reaching to satisfactory levels with growth over FY'20. In the interim, we continue to strengthen our position in circulation by energizing our distribution channels to onboard new readers as well as focus on institutional sales as an added stream of revenues and growth. We are hopeful that this strategy will allow us to tap the organic readers' universe that we already have in our market.
Our leadership position in the market has helped us attract a wide variety of advisers, both from the traditional categories like real estate, jewelry, education as well as new way sectors like e-commerce, startup, fintech, et cetera. We will continue to strengthen our advertising funnel by innovations such as award-winning special editions while providing a platform to advertiser for hyperlocal ad campaigns.
On our financial performance and cost optimization, as we have been pointing out over the past few quarters, our singular focus has been to ensure that our various cost-cut measures are long-lasting. As indicated in our press release, while we are working towards increasing our revenue base, we have also managed to save approximately 6% in the operating costs, vis-à-vis Q1 of FY 2020. Resultantly, the Print business EBITDA margin for Q1 FY 2023 stood strong at 20%.
EBITDA margin expanded by more than 700 basis points despite newsprint prices' headwinds. We believe that the newsprint prices are peaking, and we should get some relief going forward from the Q3 of this year. This is all from our side, and my colleagues and I would be now happy to respond to your questions. Thank you very much.
[Operator Instructions] Our first question is from the line of Bhagyesh Kagalkar from HDFC Mutual Fund.
Thanks for the level of disclosures in your result bulletin. Just two questions, which are actually in mind of many investors. One is our payroll strategy of over 2, 3 years, how it will shape up? And secondly, the issue that comes from the -- all the media versus the -- our issues with Google and other western technology company -- companies also that we are not getting fair share of revenues and you invested so heavily in a continued cost base basically?
The first is about the payout.
Payroll, how we are going to do?
Well, I thought payout, okay. My mistake.
The payroll strategy, New York Times personally have taken out constantly.
As you know, in digital, we have already reached to a level of 17 million monthly active users on our app, and these numbers are pretty steady from last 3, 4 months, as you must have noticed, despite -- if you look at my other competitors, if I look at any other news channel or app and all that, they all have gone down in numbers. So that clearly indicates that we have found the stickiness with our readers very clearly. Our time spent also is almost like 13 minutes. That's also pretty encouraging for the news app. All this is happening, I think, as you mentioned about the payroll, that's the way forward for us. Now whether it should happen in a couple of quarters or we need to wait a bit more, I guess, we are still working on it.
Yes. The second question was regarding the revenue strategy that we need to get from Google and other western technology companies because the...
The Digital Newspaper Association and Indian Newspaper Association -- Society, they both have filed complaints or a petition with Competition Commission of India, requesting them to have a look at this aspect so that the -- some giants those who are misusing their monopoly, they should not do it, and they should share the fair amount of revenue with all the publishers. So the matter is sub-judice, and we are very hopeful to get a positive outcome from them soon.
Okay, then you can answer the question on payout also actually?
Sorry, sir. Oh, payout?
Payout related, what are your views?
This is to inform you, our Board today recommended INR 3 dividend, which is going to be recommended to the AGM now for this payment. This is interim dividend, which will be done. And then I think there will be further both going ahead.
Our next question is from the line of Nikhil Chandak from JM Financial Family Office.
Actually, my questions are in continuation to what Bhagyesh just asked. So any numbers which you could share both on the paying for the app, so to say -- paying for the news. And also on the Google assuming the order goes in favor of the INS and -- like it has been in some of the other countries. What can be the likely or approximate revenue accretion which can really happen from that?
In fact, in our petition, that's one of the points we have mentioned to CCI that please ask Google to disclose the exact advertising income they make it from India. And then based on that, some ratio to be decided on. So I think we should wait for the honorable CCI to decide on that, number one.
Second -- sorry, first, you asked about the money which we can get from the app and all that correct? The payroll?
That's right. That's right. Yes.
I think we are also evaluating it, understanding it from the market. Should take a couple of more quarters.
Understood. Understood. Or maybe some any global model which you are trying to kind of understand and...
We are studying all the possible models, which have been adopted by publishers in Europe and U.S. I understand that. But at the same time, we'll have to see it from the Indian perspective and then take a call on that.
Our next question is from the line of Amit Khetan from Laburnum Capital.
Sir, can you provide some color on the advertising yields. Where are they relative to pre-COVID levels? And where do you eventually see them going like -- would they recover to 100% of pre-COVID levels? Or would they be slightly lower and by when?
Now this advertising yield, again, we are looking at category-wise. So some categories yields are already higher than the pre-COVID level. But some categories are still struggling. Now it is true, it's a function of the category behavior in the market. So for example, real estate category, we are higher than the pre-COVID level because that category has already bounced back in a big way. But in our auto sector, that's still struggling because the automobile category as such is down. So yes, that's the way we are looking at it.
But on average, where would you be related to pre-COVID?
Still below the expected number.
Okay. And you expect recovery by Q3, which is the festive season?
I can say, yes, we are trying for it. But will the recovery happen faster? Because, see, there are two challenges we are facing. One is the yield improvement and also ticket size improvement. So at the negotiation table, you may decide either of it. So we are taking a call accordingly.
Understood. Understood. And secondly, in terms of number of copies, where are we, again, relative to pre-COVID?
We are now at 42 lakh copies in this quarter. Summer quarter is generally slightly lower than the normal. So we hope that in this Q2 of this year, the copies should increase by a couple of lakhs. Compared to the pre-COVID, which is '19, '20, this is certainly down by almost 10%, 15%.
[Operator Instructions] Our next question is from the line of Riya from Aequitas Investments.
Yes, good set of numbers, congratulations. So just wanted to have a word about -- where are you seeing the advertisement basically coming from, like you said, like real estate doing well. You expect auto to do good. So what part -- could you give a percentage wise breakup of which segment from how much of the total advertisement revenue?
I have the whole chart in front of me, but because of the competitive environment, I don't want to read out the whole chart for you, but let me still give you the flavor. Education as a category contributes the most because of the Q1. Because in Q1, that's the education season time. Followed by government and then real estate and FMCG. Real estate is doing very well. If I compare real estate with -- and I'm telling you that I don't want to compare any number with last year because last year was a COVID hit month. So all the numbers show the growth of 100%, 200%, looks very fancy.
We should compare ourselves with '19/'20, which was a normal year. If I compare from that year, the real estate is up by almost 30%. Jewelry is up; big, big time, even health sector is up. 3 sectors which are down, which are making an impact. One is education. Education is actually not down. Education has shifted because of the results. All the results this time came late. Generally, the NEET results, the class 10 and 12 results, they all come in the month of April and May. This time, they -- all results shifted to July and August, so that's the reason the advertising got shifted. Apart from that, government for us is down for certain reasons, which we have briefed you earlier also. And automobile is one category, which is still big time down because of their short supply.
Okay. And are we really -- or a business on the FMCG rise?
FMCG contributes around 5% to our overall equity and which is -- if I compare '19/'20, it's flat right now.
Okay. And government was saying something that it's been a declining time. So is it because the elections have got over and now there are no further elections, something like that?
Yes, part of it, that way also.
Okay. So in the next quarter of the coming years, which segment of -- which is going to make a major impact apart from real estate?
I think education will make a big impact. FMCG, automobile should do a lot well going forward.
Okay. And I also asked the second question on the cost front. Can this -- paper costs rising so much. Could you give a flavor on it, like what was the cost before and what it's been right now? And are we able to pass on the entire cost in the circulation? Like are we breaking even just to sort of the circulation basis or what? How do we look at it?
First of all, thank you very much to give us the hope that we can break even on the circulation, though we are not breaking on circulation because generally, newspaper model is -- right now is not that really breakeven on the circulation price. Anyway, just to give you the number. On the newsprint prices, if I compare with '21/'22, we were at around INR 41,000 tonnes -- per tonne, which, this year, is at INR 62,000 per tonne. So a big 50% -- 51% jump in the overall price of newsprint. While I see the Q4 of last year, then the price was roughly around INR 50,000 because we had the old stock.
So as the old stock getting consumed, the new stock coming at a higher price. But one silver lining, what we recently came to know that government of India is thinking to do something with the custom duty of 5% on the imported newsprint. So if that finds the favor with the government, that 5% duty will go away, and that will have an impact on imported as well as Indian newsprint also in terms of pricing. Another point, which is right now working a little negative is the dollar price. Because the dollar price is going up, my imported parity with Indian newsprint as well as the foreign goes up. So that's another concern right now. So all in all, newsprint is one big elephant in the room, which we are still struggling with.
Okay. Great. So give me like with the [ high slots ] which we are giving. So have we increased our rates or how is it?
We have increased our cover price by 5% if I compare last year number. We have -- we are right now at INR 4.76 average cover price of our newspaper. We have some room there, maybe 5%, 7% more room to increase the prices.
Okay. Okay. Got it. But if we increase the whole by 7%, we can just pass on the incremental pricing with the paper cost.
_
Yes.
[Operator Instructions] Our next question is from the line of Himanshu Upadhyay from O3 Capital.
Congrats on good set of numbers. I had a question on this thing. See, the circulation numbers and we stated earlier is sort of like we should look at Q-on-Q numbers, okay? But they are flattish, okay. How quickly, can we get the circulation at this price point of newsprint, maybe it is not profitable. But what is your view? And can the ad rates what we are getting, the yield rate will be dependent upon the circulation copies what we are giving or is the number? And how do you think about growing those numbers?
Okay. So there are two different things. Let me answer them that way. One is that is the absolute circulation copies going forward will increase? Answer is yes. We are working on it. As, for example, the average of the quarter, which we mentioned to you around 42. As in the month of July itself, we have got another 60,000 copy growth over that number. So we are hopeful that the copies will grow furthermore, number one. Number two, from the advertiser perspective, I think one good thing has happened that in spite of whatever little copy we have lost because of the COVID and the format of the office sales and all that, I would say my market share in various markets have improved, which means if I have lost X number of copies, maybe the market and the competition has lost much more.
So whether it's a market of Madhya Pradesh or Rajasthan or Punjab, Haryana, in most of these markets, my market share has improved. In few markets, I have maintained my market share, like Bihar I maintained my market share in spite of me losing and competition also losing. So that's a good sign that if my market share improve and the copies are further growing, I think that's a very positive sign.
Okay. And I really see some players reducing their presence in certain markets? Or just trying to leave some of the larger players [indiscernible] just to understand.
So we have not seen anybody leaving the space. But yes, because of the newsprint price hike, we can clearly see a lot of people are compromising in their product. So if the pages were say 16, they brought it down to 14 or 12. They're using bad quality newsprint and all that, that certainly is helping us to gain the market share.
Okay. And on the advertisement rates in the -- for newspapers?
_
Sorry, sir?
Advertisement rate, okay? The yield, okay?
Yes. So I think that's what we are pushing that the yields should improve since our market -- see the advertising rates are the -- in a way they are the resultant of your reach in market as well as a leadership position in market. So since our leadership position comparatively has gone up, so we are the reason asking for a better yield.
And on the radio, how is the utilization and the rates, means in Q4, I think, or Q3, we have stated that the yields or rates we have increased, the improvement is on the yields? Or do you think the both things are improving, [ the yields ] as well as the capacity utilization?
Right now, we are including both. We are using volumes. We have also, in the last 2 years, there's a category called non-airtime on radio, that used to be less than 20%, roughly 15%. We have pushed that category. So without burning inventory, we are earning a lot of activations and -- on your activities, which don't consume our space. We have basically introduced both. And that non-airtime activity gets us better realization stake. But for the commercial that we were paying earlier, we have seen some improvement in the yield, but we have further room for improving the yield. But right now, focused on getting back our full volume, which we have and we are able to maintain our value as a result of that.
[Operator Instructions] Our next question is from the line of Gaurav Gandhi from Glorytail Capital Management.
Congratulations on the good set of numbers. [Foreign Language]
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Our next question is from the line of Mohit Khanna from Banyan Capital Advisors.
Congratulations on very good set of numbers here. I just wanted to get more clarity on newsprint. So are you importing from Canada or Russia, first of all? And then you did mention newsprint pricing. I think I could not get it. If you could repeat that? And then yes, first this and then probably I will get back.
So newsprint prices, let me tell you, last year, quarter 1 was at around INR 41,000 per tonne blended for Indian and imported. This year, it has become around INR 62,000 per tonne. So around 51% price hike in terms of newsprint. Coming to your second point, are we importing? Yes, we are importing. And our imported percentage is also in the range of around 30%, 35%, we are importing in the current quarter. Last year, the import was higher because the rate was better for imported than Indian. Because of Ukraine war, our Russian import has almost come to a standstill, like on halt. Because of that, we are not able to import much from Russia, but we are taking the quantity right now from wherever we are able to get it.
Fair enough. And when you say -- when we talk about the ad yields and the ticket size, that is the negotiation trade-off that you mentioned, right? What is your sense among the advertisers largely on a small scale in small cities? What is the traction you are seeing? And is there sort of an inflection point wherein, by this Diwali, where you would be -- you see an inflection point wherein you have a -- you will get a decent ticket size and yields might start to pick up from there on?
So what happens is that newspaper business, the ticket size is more critical to be very honest. Because I'm not a radio or a TV business where my 24 hours are fixed. So for example, on a particular day, if I get double the revenue, double the volume or triple the volume, I can publish it. I can increase the number of pages. So that's the reason my large focus is also on the ticket size. Even if I have to not take the yield hike, for example, if I'm looking at a 10% yield hike and if somebody comes and offer me those -- kind of offer you 5% yield hike, but I offer you 20% ticket size increment, I will take that.
[indiscernible] So now let me just rephrase the question here. In terms of different categories that you mentioned, education, government, real estate. In these categories, where do you have -- where have you seen the biggest ticket size or ticket size increment -- sorry increase recently? And where is your expectation that in which segment, its need to go a lot higher?
Real estate is one category where we have seen a big ticket size increase.
Okay. And then education, jewelry, FMCG?
Education, not much because a very seasonal thing. Jewelry, yes, few clients, yes. But across the category, if I see real estate is one.
So real estate is just one category that you would point out, which is definitely witnessing ticket size and yield increases on both, right?
Yes, sir.
Is that the fair way to look at it? Okay.
Yes.
Our next question is from the line of Rishikesh from RoboCapital.
Sir, can you please share the quantum of the ad spend in Q1? And for how long are we looking to continue to spend?
Ad spend in terms of digital marketing you're talking about?
Yes, sir.
Okay. Digital marketing, not only that spend, the overall money which was spent in the Q1 and some in the last Q4 also, it was largely more in the Q4, not in this Q1.
Okay. Sir, are we still continuing that like increase spends for coming quarters?
No, no, no. Now since we have got a pretty good size and a good traction of the market. So we have reduced drastically the marketing spend on digital. I think the organic growth is very good, very encouraging.
Okay. So like we have almost like completed the investment phase of that or the ad spending phase of that, right?
I think you misunderstood me. We are still in the investment phase. Why because investment is not about advertising alone, investment is in the technology, is in the manpower, is in the infrastructure, everything. At the same time, some bit of marketing also. So our investment phase will continue because 17 million is not our ultimate benchmark. We need to go 5x more.
Our next question is from the line of [ Falguni Datta ] of [indiscernible] Securities.
I have one question. How much was the cover price increase that we took in FY '22 in all?
FY'22. It is from INR 4.33 we went up to INR 4.62, INR 0.30, almost 8% increase overall.
And some increase in Q1 as well, right? Because you said now it's INR 4.76.
It is now INR 4.76, if I compare Q-on-Q. It means INR 4.53 has become INR 4.76. That's the reason if you notice, my overall circulation revenue has gone up to 4.5%, 5% almost.
Okay. And sir, another question on this is, suppose, newsprint prices tomorrow to come -- if they come off significantly, will we be able to retain this price increase?
Yes, very much because we have not passed on much to worry there, no?
Yes. So at least we get a benefit of that. I mean, as you mentioned, we are not bringing even there. So at least doing that -- is this come off and we are able to regain, at least we may be able to breakeven or make some bit?
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Absolutely.
And sir, another question, just pardon me for my ignorance, like on this digital thing, whenever it becomes -- whenever you start charging money from the app users is another thing. But do we also get revenue from the ads which people could be showing there because I've never used it, so I'm just asking you, like do we become as and when you come in already?
Allow me to make a request to you that start using my app, it's good and very knowledgeable. Number two, advertising point of view, right now, we are not taking any ads on our app. But going forward, the company has plans to start taking -- accepting ads over there.
Okay. And just as an import like many papers, which -- this is just an import many papers that we had earlier been taking physical copies from, for now, in COVID times, we've shifted to digital. And I -- what I feel I just checked a few papers like -- this is all in the English print, but all of them -- people are now willing to pay the digital mode.
_
Yes. That's what we are hoping that people -- readers in our market were also willing to pay and accept to pay.
Our next question is from the line of Anuj Sharma from M3 Investments.
One is, I appreciate your capital allocation policies and strategies. My question is on pagination. If we compare pre-COVID and currently, what is the difference in pagination? And how do you see that going forward? I understand it's a function of volumes, but just getting [indiscernible] today?
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So for example, this quarter, we were at almost 19 pages average compared to last year this quarter at 16 basis, that was a COVID hit time. But if I compare this with '19/'20, '19/'20, it was 23 pages average. So which means we still have to go up by 4 pages more to achieve the pre-COVID number, and that's where the advertising has to come in picture.
Okay. And that will be a function of the ad-to-edit ratio as we go forward?
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Yes.
Any outlook as to when do you think you can reach that internally?
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We have been really working hard. Our teams are really working hard to see how we can further grow the advertising revenue. In some areas, we are getting good results, but something here and there keeps happening. So let's hope the newsprint prices soften down, the advertising also comes back.
Our next question is a follow-up from the line of Riya from Aequitas Investments.
Sir, this question is really from a radio business perspective. So we are -- so like I just wanted to -- are we maintaining our market share there? And what is the incremental advertisement we are getting from there, like -- could you explain me like the current scenario in the real estate?
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So on the market share, happy to share with you that our market share compared to the quarter '19 we are already sitting at a very high market share despite a lot of reduction in the price. We've been able to maintain our market share, not just maintain our market share in terms of volume, but we actually up our value share across all our sectors and healthy mix of advertising from all categories. And that has the mix of advertising categories -- value from all advertising categories.
Sorry, I couldn't hear you?
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I was saying that healthy mix of advertising categories, and we've been able to maintain our market share basis '19/'20 Q1 is at the same level. And we have upped -- our market value share of wallet has gone up in most of the market as well because our rates have been better than the market.
Okay. And for the radio business, what would be the major advertising sources, like segmental wise?
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Again, all same. Lifestyle would be one large category followed by health care, FMCG, electronics, real estate, education, banking, finance, all the dot com companies.
Okay. And or -- are you seeing some resistance from the players for advertising?
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Mister, I didn't hear you properly?
So basically, are we seeing some curtail in the radio ad spends because as we are [indiscernible] that as a positive of the entire -- where advertiser spend by the major FMCG, they are more of doing social media advertisement right now and curtailing on likes of radio, TV businesses. So are we seeing any impact of that?
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Not in our markets, but we are seeing some reduction in volumes in the bigger cities, but our stations are all in Tier 2 and Tier 3 cities, and we still see a lot of companies coming -- being interested in our markets. But we do see, when we look at the AdEx at the big cities, we do see a reduction, though, but not in Tier 2, Tier 3.
I'm sorry to interrupt, ma'am. Maybe a request, please return to the question queue. We have several other participants waiting to ask question.
It's a last question. Yes. So what would be the yields here in the radio business, advertisement yields?
So that depends on the station to station.
Okay. And on average, if possible, if you could give me a ballpark number?
We will not be able to give you this competitive information now, please. I hope you'll appreciate it.
Our next question is from the line of Ankit Shah from White Equity.
Sir, can you share the expected percentage increase in inventory cost in, let's say, Q2 and Q3?
Tough question. We are at INR 62,000 per tonne in Q1. I think Q2 will be at least maybe 3% to 3.5% more because of the new stock coming in picture.
Right, right. And Q3 should be further higher or should be at this...
We can actually go down because we've been getting some softening indications from the mill in the Southern India as well as the import duty cut assumption by the government. If that happens, then I think Q3 should see a cutdown.
Okay. Great. And you have estimated a fair bit of cash on the balance sheet. Apart from the two dividends, is there likely to be any accelerated payout maybe in the form of a special dividend or buyback?
Right now, in the balance sheet as a cash bank and mutual fund, we have INR 532 crores in the balance sheet. And we have -- Board has announced a dividend of INR 3 right now. And I'm sure, it has been our policy in the last so many years, we don't sit much on the cash. So going forward, this money will be utilized in the best possible manner for the stakeholders.
Our next question is from the line of [ Harshit ] from Flare Capital.
Great set of numbers. Congratulations on that first. Yes, my first question. How -- current digital revenue, sir? And going forward, how much do we get?
Our digital revenue currently, as I mentioned to you, we don't accept the advertising on the app. So zero from the app, but we still have some revenue from the web. We accept the advertising on the web. So there is some revenue on the web, but that is not our focus area. And going forward, there will be a big revenue source coming from the advertising and subscription going forward.
Okay. Okay. And till date, how much investment have we made in this digital strategy?
If you remember, sir, 2 years back, I took the liberty of requesting all the investors to allow us not to disclose the digital number separately because of the competitive environment, and you all were kind enough to allow us not to do that. So yes, so that's the reason we are not disclosing the separate numbers for digital.
No problem. I apologize. I am a new investor. Okay. And 75% of the print revenue comes from ad and 25% comes from [ power ] prices?
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Yes, sir.
Do we expect to be in the same ratio going forward?
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Yes, largely, this will be -- ranges around 80-20 also when the advertising goes up. It can go up to 80% and the circulation would be 20%.
Okay. But below 75%, we are not targeting?
As of now, no, because advertising is also a big revenue and when the circulation revenue goes up, advertising also goes up.
Okay. And with the shift happening to digital, do we face the problem of cannibalization [indiscernible]? Is it happening within our customers?
I would say, yes, to some extent. For example, if we have lost around 10% copies, I'm sure there would be some 4%, 5% people those who are reading my newspaper earlier, now around the app, like I was talking to a friend of mine, he used to subscribe 2 copies of Bhaskar, one in at home and one in his office. Now he says my home copy is Bhaskar, but in office, I see your app. So that one copy is lost because of the app, but I think that way that reader is more bounded with me throughout the day with the morning newspaper and the app both.
Our next question is from the line of Amit Khetan from Laburnum Capital.
Just one question around. So you -- I see that on a quarter-on-quarter basis, your other OpEx has come down by almost INR 30 crores. Is this mostly the -- is this entirely the reduced digital marketing spend? And is this a sustainable number?
Yes, largely.
Our next question is from the line of Pawan Nahar, an individual investor.
So my question is, I'm just trying to understand, last call, we said we would look at a tax effective way of distributing money, right? Now our ownership is around 70% -- let's say, 70.5%. So wouldn't a proportionate buyback -- wouldn't that have been a more tax effect? I'm trying to understand how does it -- how do you rationalize paying so much tax unless we promote our entities, they are more tax efficient or they have other expenses, whatever I mean it shows...
I appreciate your point of view, Mr. Nahar, and I will certainly put up this note up to my Board so that...
You don't need to put it up. Your Board is very wise and two of you are here. I mean you are very wise, you run your business so efficiently. I'm sure there's a reason if you're doing it [indiscernible], that's your choice. But I was wondering, last time you have said that. Anyway, that was one point.
The second point was, so the interim plus the previous year's final -- so interim dividend of this fiscal comes first. And the final dividend of the previous fiscal will come later?
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Yes, after the AGM.
And the AGM is being held, I don't know if we regularly do it, but this time seems to be quite late because most of the -- most of the, I would say, efficient companies and investor-friendly companies tend to do it early, right, the way you're reporting your numbers, I mean?
Our AGM is scheduled by mid of September, sir.
Yes. That's made by your standards. I would imagine, but never mind. So I just have one request. One is if we could do something about being more tax efficient on the dividend given that you have headroom in your ownership, right? And if we change much? And second was, instead of this final dividend, it is better if we have to give 2 dividends, let's say, this year? Do 2 interims and finish it off in the fiscal itself. It's just a thought.
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We'll certainly consider your thought, sir.
Our next question is from the line of Harshit, an Individual Investor.
Yes, am I clear?
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Yes sir.
Yes, my questions have been answered. I just like to -- I just like to ask you one question. How are we -- how will we compete ourselves with our competitors? I would like to just know about that? [Foreign Language] like competition from companies like Jagran or any other? They are doing very well I think, yes.
Why don't we take this question offline with you because the answer would entail almost an hour, and we'll be very...
Okay. Something in brief if possible -- something in brief for 30, 40 -- 1, 1 minute.
I'm very proud to say from my team perspective, that all 8,000, 9,000 people, those who are directly working with Dainik Bhaskar and thousands of them, those who are indirectly working with the Bhaskar Group, I think we all are very passionate about our work. And that's the reason why day in and day out, we are able to produce newspaper, which people really look forward to seeing it in the morning and they did give that 30 minutes to us. And from every perspective, I think team is doing a fantastic job. That's the reason why even in the difficult times, we were able to sell through comparatively better and smoothly in most of the markets. And especially, I would like to take this opportunity to talk about my editorial team.
Because the kind of stories our teams are coming out with, they're investigating fearlessly. And mind you mean that this fearless word is very easy and simple to say, but to live that word is really difficult. Like I must say that a couple of months back, my Bihar team did a story on sand mafia. Now you know how things are and how the mafia would operate, but still they did the story and we gave an option to the reporter that if he doesn't want his name to be published, we could drop his name, but he said, no, please go ahead and publish my name because I'm willing to face any consequences if anybody wants to. I think I must really put forward the kind of effort my editorial team and all of the teams are making to make sure that our readers are engaged and feel knowledgeable and feel that yes, we are working for them.
Ladies and gentlemen, due to time constraints, that was the last question. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
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Thank you, everyone, for your participation and time on this earnings call today. I hope we were responded to your queries [indiscernible] today, and we'll always be happy to be of assistance through our Investor Relations Department, headed by Mr. Prasoon Kumar Pandey for all your further inquiry. Take care, everyone, and stay safe. Thank you. Have a good evening ahead.
Thank you.
Thank you very much, Mr. Agarwaal and members of the management team. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of D.B. Corp. Limited, that concludes this conference call. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.