Porto Seguro SA

BOVESPA:PSSA3

Earnings Call Transcript 2022-Q2

[Operator]

This presentation is being recorded and translated simultaneously into English. The slides presented are available for download at our site. After the close of the presentation, we will go on to the question-and-answer session. We suggest you send your name and company name through the QA icon at the bottom of the screen. As a dynamic, your names will be announced, enabling you to pose your question live. At this time, there will be a request on the screen for you to turn your microphone on. In case you do not wish to use your microphone, please write without mic at the end of the question, so the operator can read the question.

The forward-looking statements made during this conference call referring to the business outlook of Porto are based on the beliefs and assumptions of the company management based on information available currently. These forward-looking statements are no guarantees of performance. They involve risks, uncertainties and assumptions that relate to future events and depend on circumstances which may or not occur. Overall economic conditions, sector conditions could impact the results of the company.

I would now like to give the floor to Roberto, the company, CEO.

[Roberto de Souza Santos, executive]

Good afternoon, everybody, and thank you for your participation in the Porto Seguro Second Quarter 2022 Conference Call. On Slide #4, we present the main highlights of the period. In the second quarter of 2022, our revenues increased 37% vis-a-vis the same period last year. And in the accumulated first 6 months, we had an increase of 29% in revenues. This was the highest quarterly and half year growth in more than 10 years with significant advances in all of our business verticals. The expansion in the number of businesses was important for this result. At Porto Seguro, we had a double-digit increase in the number of customers in life and business insurance. While the insured fleet of [indiscernible] showed resilience with a slight increase in the annual comparison, even in the face of price adjustments made in the Porto Saude vertical, we had a 35% growth in the insured base, representing the addition of more than 100,000 lives in the last 12 months, approaching 400,000 insured lives.

In Porto Seguro Bank, we continued to expand our client portfolio reaching 3.6 million businesses at the end of the quarter to the increase of more than 300,000 businesses in the period, driven mainly by credit card, rent guarantee and consortium products in services Carro Facil increased by 46%, the number of subscription vehicles besides having improved its EBITDA margin. I would like to underscore the completion of the spin-off of assistance services for Porto Assistencia. This generates opportunities such as offering services to new audiences, the development of new services and gains of scale contributing to increasing operational efficiency. Regarding results, we had a challenging quarter, mainly impacted by higher auto claims that continues to be impacted due to indemnity and repair costs in addition to higher vehicle circulation compared to the previous year. Marcelo Picanco will further explore this in his presentation.

The increase in CDC operation defaults impacted by the macroeconomic scenario, higher funding costs and the financial result, mostly explained by the performance of variable income allocations. However, we also saw signs of improvement in the period, such as a reduction in auto claims when compared to the first quarter the effect of adjustments we made in pricing and risk underwriting. We also saw signs of stabilization in the delinquency of credit operations. The result of measures we adopted, such as a greater restriction in the release of new credits due to the macroeconomic scenario. We have also continued to increase operational efficiency as can be seen by the 2.2 percentage point reduction in the company's total administrative expense ratio in the quarter. We have been successful in expanding our customer base, focusing on the quality of products and services offered, profitability and the company's perpetuity. We truly are confident in the measures adopted to recompose our margins to levels that are historical in our business.

In the ESG agenda, we took some additional important steps such as joining the UN Global Compact committing to the 10 universally accepted principles in the areas of human right, labor, environment and anticorruption, in addition to the approval to create a sustainability committee linked to the Board of Directors, which will have as its first objective, the monitoring of indicators related to compliance of the 17 UN Sustainable Development Goals known as the SDGs. Well, in closing, I would like to thank the trust of employees, brokers, service providers, suppliers, customers and other stakeholders of portal. And therefore, I would like to ask Celso to continue commenting on more detail on the evolution of revenues and profitability in the second quarter of '22. Thank you.

[Celso Damadi, executive]

Thank you, Roberto, and a good day to all of you. I will begin on Slide #5 to speak about the growth in total revenue. We had the largest growth in more than 10 years. In all the business verticals, we achieved significant revenue growth in the quarter and in the half of the year. And we reached BRL 6.8 billion, a growth of 36.7% a very impressive growth. And in the semester, almost BRL 13 million. Now this growth in the first half of the year will help us in the results of the third and fourth quarters when it comes to the growth of premiums. Now in the insurance vertical, we grew 13.1%; in Porto Seguro Bank, 32.5%; Porto Seguro Health with 47% and services with 48.8%. This robust growth, as mentioned, will help us in the premiums gained because we also have what we call the retained services.

As Roberto mentioned, our historical profitability is above the basic interest rate. We see the graph on Slide #6. But this quarter, we were below our historical profitability. Of course, we will be exploring this further as well Marcelo and Sami will be doing this, but the loss ratio did have an impact on the results. Izak will refer to our financial results. We worked with the rollover of some securities as an impact in coming quarters and preparing the results for the coming years of the company. So the second semester will also be impacted by this rollover of securities that was planned and structured. We had lower profitability, preparing the company for better results in coming quarters. This is what we expect. We will also have a gain of productivity and all of the premiums will be diluted as part of our administrative and operating expenses.

I would now like to give the floor to Marcelo Picanco to speak about Porto Seguro Insurance.

[Marcelo Picanço, executive]

Thank you, Celso. Thank you for attending our call. In the insurance vertical, we had an expressive revenue growth in the second quarter, basically due to 2 drivers: The first, the auto business basically due to a significant increase in the renewal of prices because of the new contracts and the adjustments in the renewals. Now when it comes to the commercial part, we had a growth in items. We are servicing an additional of 30,000 companies more vis-a-vis what we had in 2021. And in life, almost 800,000 people. So both of these segments in commercial had a very good growth and here, the price dynamic is more stable. Now this allowed us to reach BRL 4.5 billion in total premiums with a growth in all of the high teens or with very good figures, reaching a volume of almost 36% of increase, which is very healthy and 28% in property and casualty, for example, we are facing a level of high loss ratio continuously.

This first half of the year was a very difficult moment for the entire sector in Brazil as well as in the rest of the country due to the inflation that needs to be recomposed in the prices. The good news is that in the second quarter, we have reached a turning point. This is the first time in 5 quarters that we have an improvement, not as expressive as we had wished, but this is an initial improvement in the combined ratio due to the loss ratio.

And with this, we have an increase in our profitability levels. Once again, not back to our historical levels, but I think we have gone through the very worst. In terms of auto, despite the high loss ratio, we are below the market loss ratio. We reached a record, reaching 78% in the first quarter vis-a-vis 67%. And in the last quarter, 76% in the market, Porto Seguro was 66%. Now we had a very strong price increase. The premium depends on our recomposition and an exchange of [indiscernible] and it reached 16%. I think that the earned premium is based on the written premium, and it shows you that we are prioritizing a recomposition of our results. Now even in the scenario with better results, we believe that our dynamic will depend on the acquisition of other items and optimization of prices. This is how we will maintain a growth that will be above and beyond that of the market.

Presently, we are focusing on this recomposition that has yes, led to a loss of market share, but this has proved that the company is focusing on recomposing its results and reaching sustainable levels that we can maintain. Our fleet is resilient, levels that are very similar to what we had a year ago. And if we look at this year, we have a drop of 1.4% despite the strong readjustment. We believe that this drop is natural and a result of what is happening because of price readjustment.

In the other businesses, we have had very sound growth with expressive enhancement in results, for example, in the commercial segment, where we have 20 points difference in terms of loss ratio vis-a-vis the market in P&C, 20%, and in life, also an expressive growth of 17% with a loss ratio. I would like to say that the comparison is very different between independent insurance channels and bank channels where this loss ratio tends to be lower. So the loss ratio is significantly lower than it was during the period of COVID at the most intense peaks of COVID, and we believe that the results will be converging to adequate levels and that growth will allow us to have a new cutoff for our business, generating efficiency gains in terms of operational and administrative expenses.

Having said that, I would like to thank you once again, and I will now give the floor to speak about Health.

[Sami Foguel, executive]

Thank you, Marcelo Picanco. It's a pleasure to be here to discuss the results for this semester. Roberto said that we had a growth of 35% in our base of life insurance. We have approximately 2 million lives covered. And I highlight the growth of revenues in life insurance, reaching 50.7% and balance growth, 35% of lives with 70% of premium shows you that we're following a very interesting direction. On the next page, a variation of 3.2% negative vis-a-vis the second quarter of '21 and loss ratio. This led us to a loss ratio of 22.87% and for the quarter, 77.9%.

Once again, a very difficult period because of loss ratio in health, we still observed important impacts due to COVID, not only here, but in all other businesses and an increase in elective treatment, but we do believe that we have maintained a reasonably controlled level, thanks to our pricing and selectivity when we renew health insurance. All of this led us to a profit of BRL 22 million in the quarter and BRL 58 million for the semester with profitability at very interesting levels.

Once again, we're going to speak about 2 important points that are questions we have received from the market. First of all, technology. We're going to speak about results that we have through our app. We have 16,000 online appointments. I'm going to speak about Porto Doctor. We have a virtual attendance something we introduced in the last quarters, artificial intelligence for bills; 88% of our bills are carried out without a human interface. We also recently, thanks to the changing system, we have had an increase in our system of quotes and emissions for SMEs. This was consolidated this quarter with significant success.

What makes us very proud at Porto and Porto Health is the launch of our medical team for Porto. This was launched recently this quarter and it has a great deal to do with the way that Porto Seguro is bringing about incredible service for our beneficiaries and medical quality, medical assistance that is a quality avoiding waste in the chain. We have more than 210 professionals in larger Sao Paulo, disseminated in 240 locations, a fully online appointment, everything online with more than 49 specialties. This is but the beginning of very important work that will bring about opportunities for continuous growth, a growth in quality and with loss ratios at a very adequate level.

With this, I would like to thank you, and I give the floor to Marcos Loucao to speak about other verticals.

[Marcos Loução, executive]

Good morning. welcome to our call, and I'm going to speak about our businesses like Porto Seguro Bank. We had an expressive revenue increase in our main portfolios. Credit card was 39%, allocation and warranty with 23% and consortium also with an increase still under the pressure of our provisions and the financing of vehicles and financing of lease or rent. But we perceive a greater stability in the second quarter vis-a-vis the first quarter of 6 percentage points. Now even with the announcement and changes of our credit policy that we began last year and that we have intensified in the first semester. We continue to generate business working with a public that is better known, and we have reached 3.6 million businesses. At the bottom, you see our app that helps the real estate companies with 150,000 announcements.

And very shortly, we will obtain benefits from cross-sell and the optimization of this channel. To speak a bit about our credit business. Our credit business reached BRL 14.3 billion, a growth of 24% compared to last year and 6% vis-a-vis the first quarter, a highlight for the credit card, where we have 2.2 million active accounts and a transaction volume of BRL 11.2 billion year-on-year to speak about the financing of vehicles. We carried out an important alteration in the channels and policies. And despite this, we have had a growth in the number of contracts because this will be very propitious for our coming quarters. With a portfolio of BRL 2.7 billion, now we have a growth of 59% in terms of risk under management vis-a-vis last year, we have 41.4 new contracts working with us. On the other page, we speak specifically about consortiums.

We continue to be leaders with a very strong growth. And of course, we're accompanying the market but doing so, even more strongly in our channels. We had a growth of 31% in our managed credit portfolio with a growth of 8% vis-a-vis the first quarter, which already was a very important quarter, 39% of sales, new ease for the customer and third-party channels. We have 39,000 shares sold, a growth of 40% year-on-year and the credit sold BRL 5.5 billion. And what is very important, we maintained that characteristic of being a consortium with very low delinquency rates despite our accelerated growth. We had 27% increase in the portfolio, 13% collection with new plants, including the commercial part and a review of our credit policy with changes compared to the first quarter '21.

Now to change topics very quickly. Two highlights in terms of services. Roberto has already mentioned that we have concluded the spin-off of assistance services for Porto Assistencia, and this will become a different business line with other options to continue growing the services. Carro Facil, which is our subscription vehicle. It is as if it were a lease company, but we work with more than 12 and 24 months. So we're working with a base profile that is quite profitable. We reached BRL 71 million and an active fleet of 12,000 vehicles with a growth of 45.7%. And in addition to having an expansion in our EBITDA margin. Basically, these are the highlights.

I will now give the floor to Izak Benaderet to speak about our investment performance.

[Izak Benaderet, executive]

Very well, I would like to refer to the results of the second quarter. Our return was 32% during the quarter, impacted mainly by the variable income operations, which have become strategic for us. We also rolled over our portfolio. We lengthened this portfolio, and we had to work with recognition. And presently, we have a return of 3.88% based on CDI in terms of a positive contribution. We had a gain in our exchange rate exposure for the second quarter. Very well, I would now like to refer to our initiatives in the environmental, social and governance field. As I mentioned during the opening, we have joined the UN Global pact. This means that the company is committed to the universally accepted principles and human rights, labor, environment and anticorruption.

In addition to the 17 SDGs with targets extending until 2030, we created a Sustainability Committee directly connected to our Board of Management with the participation of members from the Board. They're going to follow up on the monitoring and compliance of the SDGs, which is a highly important point and I move forward in terms of this for more than 20 years. Porto has already had initiatives that collaborate with most of the SDGs. We have always done this very spontaneously as it's our way of being to become a safe haven for people's lives. I would also like to highlight that we have been certified as a Great Place to Work.

In Brazil, of course, this is the first time that we participated and received this certification recognition for the work that we carry out to build an empathic, inclusive and safe haven working environment for people. We also have Merco and ESG ranking and corporate reputation. We won the first place and also were ranked in terms of responsibility. Once again, we are in the 17th ranking in terms of corporate reputation and insurance category among the 100 companies that were assessed. Now these are the environmental, social and operational factors that we wanted to highlight in the presentation.

At this point, we would like to go on to the question-and-answer session.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The first question comes from JPMorgan. Mr. Grespan, you may proceed, sir.

[Guilherme Grespan, analyst]

We have 2 questions on our side. First of all, regarding expenses. There are 3 lines that call attention. The cost of services rendered that included BRL 150 million quarter-on-quarter and BRL 60 million increase in personnel expenses and another increase of BRL 60 million. Now the question is, if these 3 line items had the impact of the service spin-off, if this is the case, which is the other line item that is the counterpart to this? We believe that there should be a net 0 effect. So which is the line item of your P&L, that would have been benefited without this change? Another question, your line item of coverage has had a drop of 5 percentage points per quarter, which would be reasonable to expect for the second semester? Will we see the same pace of the drop? Will there be a normalization of this indices or a recomposition of your coverage index?

[Celso Damadi, executive]

Guilherme, thank you for the question. This is Celso speaking. The first question about the cost of services rendered, you're quite right. The impact of BRL 160 million is offset by the increase in revenues at Porto Seguro services. So it will have no impact on our balance. It does increase the line of expenses in the consolidated balance, but it also increases the revenues in service rendering. It is not a loss of operational results. It's just a spin-off increasing revenues on one side and the revenues on the other. The net effect is 0 in the consolidated balance. Secondly, the increase of BRL 60 million in personnel. We have the collective bargaining that was launched somewhat late at the -- it should have been at the end of February. This was done in March. And some of the labor provisions ended up being accounted for in April.

And in April, we paid T&L, all of the managers. There is an event in April, and this represents BRL 18 million. This is an event that is held in the month of April and has an impact on the second quarter. This is an event held in the second quarter, and it does have an impact on administrative expenses vis-a-vis the first quarter. This is the line of managers share of results. So these are the effects that you observe. Now in other operating expenses, we include the cost of funding and much more. Now referring to the cost of funding at Porto Insurance, Carro Facil and others, we will hear an explanation for this. Now regarding the cost of funding, the funding of vehicles, especially in 2022, [indiscernible] from 2 to 10 in very few months. And this ended up causing pressure in our expenses. And of course, it is part of our portfolio.

And this is what has generated this mismatch regarding Carro Facil. The effect has been very similar, although as part of the price, we had included this future rate. It was not sufficient because of the increases. This did not only impact our portfolio, but that of everybody working with operations. Regarding your second question, the coverage index. We now have what we had before the pandemic in 2'19. And we have the recovery of doubtful payments and the delay of the new groups -- these have been maintained. There should be no reduction in this index, and the outlook is for an enhancement. But we're back to the levels with which we were operating in 2'19.

[Operator]

The next question comes from Thiago Mascarenhas from BTG Pactual.

[Thiago Paura Mascarenhas, analyst]

The question is there has been an increase in elective premiums and when will this translate into better results?

[Marcelo Picanço, executive]

Thiago, this is Marcelo Picanco. Thank you for the question. As we had forecast, we believe that beginning in the second half of the year, well, the year 2022 was divided into 2 halves. The first half was an impact and 2 phenomena will happen in the second half. We have new groups. We have a very dynamic pricing, and the pricing has been adjusted through time. So the values will be better than those of last year. The second factor is that we're also adopting additional actions and also in loss ratio and in optimizing operations. And they will reflect in greater gains for the second half of the year.

We truly believe that the second half of the year will be more positive in terms of results when compared to the first half. And we do have that mass of the earned premiums, but we also have additional underwriting actions that we have adopted. And they will go through the entire portfolio, and they will apply to all of our new clients. There is a second question on financial results. We have a very small exposure in shares. But despite this, we have suffered a great deal. Now the higher Selic will this reflect in a more predominant way in the portfolio.

And another question if we have rolled over more of our DLT securities. Thank you for the question. our portfolio, if we look at it in the last few years, has always had a very relevant component of TMD with a rigorous activity in the last few years. We continue on with this bias with the hedge that we have worked on. And we're a little far away from the CDI itself. Now this is something we have done historically.

As these portfolios have been lengthening because of the higher interest rate that we have had in the last 2 years. We're going to enhance the real interest rates but we don't have that trend towards CDI. Regarding the position of variable income, the exposure of variable income, it is not a very great exposure for the semester was 20%. And this was what was responsible for moving us away from the CDI. We also had a result of BRL 30 million that comes from the longer or the [indiscernible] portfolios and the rollover.

A question from a [indiscernible] asking about the growth strategy for credit. And if we're going to focus more on well-known clients, if we could hear some more color on this strategy, please?

[Marcos Loução, executive]

Hello, [ Murilo ]. This is Loucao speaking, our strategy continues to be one of growth as well as of expansion and we have realigned especially in the vehicle financing portfolio in the first semester. This was a portfolio that had been expanded more than others. So these are the adjustments that we have just carried out. Simply to recap, we do understand that we should pursue our growth agenda, and we should pursue that cross-sell agenda with all of the products at Porto, we have 3.6 million clients that have very good knowledge of Porto Seguro.

They have a product in credit in Porto Seguro investments, and it will be easier to sell insurance to them. Only 3% of our business would have additional room, without mentioning that we have also had significant expansion in terms of the consortium and the credit card within channels and especially within our auto insurance clients. We're going to continue to pursue growth and focus on this. We're going to work. Well, there has been a restriction in terms of the vehicle segment vis-a-vis what we did in the past.

[Operator]

A question from Antonio from Bank of America.

[Antonio Gregorin Ruette, analyst]

We have 2 questions. The first, your new prices, if you could remind us the behavior of Porto in the last 12 months. Looking at the ticket per se, when these higher price increases took place? And the second question, referring to default, if you could refer to the sources of default, we see the behavior of funding of the credit card, what are your expectations in these fields?

[Marcelo Picanço, executive]

This is Marcelo Picanco. We should separate this into 2 parts, and I showed this in the previous call between August and December of last year, there was an increase of 40% in value, a very fast increase. Now our renewal portfolio, we have to work with more cautiously. And this process began in November, but we have different renewal indices because of what we observed as a trend and the dynamics, and they became deeper through time, especially for insurance. August, November with stronger readjustment indices beginning at the very beginning of the year 2022.

[Marcos Loução, executive]

Now this is Loucao. Now to speak about your question referring to default as part of the credit card portfolio. We have a default that is below that of the market, and what is above the market is the part of the vehicle, something that I mentioned before. Now what can I say about this in credit cards and in the funding of vehicles, we have better recovery indices. This helps us in our recomposition. When we speak about new groups or harvest, the portfolio is doing much better. We have very good default indices when we look at a shorter portfolio and we compare ourselves to traditional banks.

We look at the second quarter vis-a-vis the first quarter with a reduction of 1 percentage point. This shows that the activities that we adopted, especially those of recovery have had a very good reaction. Now if we look at the scenario of inflation, unemployment and the macroeconomic situation as a whole, we're being very cautious. We have attempted to be very cautious in releases, especially in the credit card portfolio. We're very careful with the limits and the release of credit cards. This is the scenario for default. In general, very positive, and we have a decrease in our NPL.

[Operator]

A question from Kaio Prato from UBS.

[Kaio Penso Da Prato, analyst]

I have 2 very short questions. The first, a follow-up in your statement. You mentioned a drop of results in variable income as one of the factors for this quarter. We see that your exposure to variable income increases quarter-on-quarter going from 3% to 4%. If you could explain this dynamic and how you have this devaluation and this increased exposure as well. The second question refers to expenses. When you announced the new verticals, you announced heavy investments in marketing large events during the second semester. If you could speak about the magnitude of impact on your expenses with these marketing activities.

[Unknown Executive]

Now regarding our allocation in variable income. This adjustment was residual minimal. There was no increase of 30% in our allocation and variable income. I'm referring to 3.3 to something like 3.9. There was no relevant increase as you can see. And once again, we had a second quarter with a relevant drop in the stock market. There was no relevant allocation at that point. The second question...

[Celso Damadi, executive]

Well, thank you for the question, Kaio. Regarding our marketing expenses -- we have an in-house practice of having marketing expenses that are very proportional to our revenues. So we follow up on marketing expenses as the proportion or ratio of our expenses -- revenues. As our revenues are growing, the marketing expenses will grow at a similar rate. And we spend on marketing according to what was budgeted. Based on that, we do not have the expectation of investing in marketing above and beyond what we have budgeted for marketing expenses. Historically, we have marketing expenses that relate to our revenue, and we will continue to respect and comply with this ratio. Once again, there is no expectation of over spending or increasing this expense more relevantly. This is how we're going to continue to behave.

[Roberto de Souza Santos, executive]

This is Roberto, Kaio. To add to what Celso said, this growth in expenses aligned with the growth of revenues is fully in accordance with the company's strategic planning with the goal of giving greater visibility to the other verticals in the company, besides the insurance vertical. Celso reminded us we do have this strategic planning and the marketing expenses are fully aligned with revenues. There is no distortion.

[Operator]

The next question is from Eduardo Nishio.

[Eduardo Nishio, analyst]

I have 2 questions. First question about the new company that you're creating. And in a certain way, the services that Porto have always been a differential, something that accompany insurance. Now you're taking it away from insurance -- now the question is in the offer of this product to clients and to B2B, if this will not have an impact on that competitive edge that you have regarding services. Perhaps it will help you to explore regions where so far you are not present in, which is the strategy underlying this and the loss ratio had a significant impact in the month of June. What is going to happen going forward, which will be the impact of loss ratio, especially for auto and P&C, which is your outlook going forward? Now my second question refers to the deinvestment in real estate that you announced in the release, we're speaking about properties. What will happen with the proceeds? Do you have profit from this? And now what will happen with this disinvestment in the coming quarters?

[Roberto de Souza Santos, executive]

Eduardo, thank you for the question. And it's interesting that you approach this aspect that is very important. First of all, regarding -- and I will explain to you our practical concept, and then we will speak about the strategy. Internally, the practical concept, the impact of loss ratio will not have an impact on the product pricing. Internally, it's an exchange of line item. This loss ratio already existed when it was brought in-house when we were paying the service render, it was through loss ratio. The other part was accounted for as operational expense because everything was done in-house. When we do all of this through contracts, the operational expenses disappear and everything becomes a loss ratio. We have an increase in the line item for loss ratio and in operational expenses, we do have a profit margin in this company that renders services.

And this margin in-house will be eliminated from our reports, and we will allocate this to the loss ratio item. Now Porto services only renders services to Porto Auto. They are the only client of this company. We still have not gained synergy with the CDF, which means that technically, this increase in loss ratio, it does not have a price allocated. We had an increase of 1.8% in loss ratio in June. But technically, there has not been a price allocated because this will return as a management credit. As a thesis and in terms of management, this change will not even have a 1 percentage point impact on our portfolio. This is what I wanted to explain, referring to Porto services. Now regarding the disposal of real estate. Last year, we had already sold BRL 90 million in real estate; the previous year, BRL 17 million in real estate and in the last few years, we have been demobilizing in the company, and you have been following up on this we had 52 businesses still on sale.

Now what we have done is to anticipate the sales creating a real estate fund. We sold all of this real estate through a fund. Now the impact on our results was not nil, no. As we transfer these real estate properties to the fund, the fund purchased, the money came into us. We increased our margins, improved our liquidity. And as the real estate fund sales of these properties, we will have a gain in terms of the accounting value -- now we estimate this will be 30 million or BRL 40 million as we sell off the properties. The economic gain is not very relevant. What is relevant is our increase in liquidity and of course, the enhancement and solvency that we had in this transaction. What we did was to anticipate the sale of these properties to a fund. This ended up being more of a financial transaction, not an economic one. Loucao will explain the dynamic of CDF for Porto.

[Marcos Loução, executive]

Now the CDF, we still have not closed the operation. But to explain the rationale, this is one of the greatest service players in the market and the size of synergies and the benefits of scale, especially in the back office when we speak about the management of service rendering. What is important is the complementarity between these 2 businesses. And our activities will not be super imposed. We have seen the opportunity of diversifying into this sector.

We already work with other brands in B2B through Porto Seguro Assistencia. We work with Harley Davidson, Samsung and some operations of the Itau Bank. So through the CDS, we can have access to utilities, retail and the telecom sector and we can have technical assistance to support the health desk, and we can even update benefits for insurance areas. We will have access to the retail market. We will work with the innovation and creation of services using all of the products that we have within Porto Seguro. And of course, the CDF itself, it was a strategic operation.

[Roberto de Souza Santos, executive]

This is Roberto simply to complement the strategy Loucao spoke about the complementarity and synergy with CDS. Now the strategy to create an assistance company has the goal of enhancing our reach to other companies and once again, opening up the possibility of offering services to other companies, including the insurance market. We saw that we needed to create new areas of service rendering for different businesses, for example, by subscription, through premium services, we can offer -- well, we are offering these services through the same channel, but we now realize we would need to have different channels for this operation. And the idea is to have other channels to render services to other companies, all under the umbrella of assistance.

We would like to thank all of you for participating in our second quarter '22 conference call. We thank all of you for your questions, for your contributions and because of your interest in Porto Seguro. If you continue to have additional doubts, please contact our IR team and all of the information is available at our IR site at ri.portoseguro.com.br. Thank you very much, and we hope to see you during the next quarter.

[Statements in English on this transcript were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call.]